News:

On Tuesday September 6th the forum will be down for maintenance from 9:30 PM to 11:59 PM PDT

Main Menu

Calls made from Romania resid./cell phone to Obi in Romania-Can't get Attendent

Started by jeetco, January 12, 2012, 10:24:37 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

jeetco

Hello,

There are two Obi's.  One in the U.S and the other in Romania.
The calls from U.S-Obi to Romania-Obi to Romania residential (other than the land line physically connected to the Romania-Obi) or Romania cell phone line work perfectly via the Obi attendants.
But the other way around, calls from Romania residental (at another location away from the Obi) or cell phone to the land line phone number that the Obi is connected to--do not get the attendent.

I got in touch with Obi support and this is what I was asked to do:

OBi in Romania:

set -> Physical Interfaces -> LINE
to have "ACImpedance" value of 270+(750||150nF) and 275+(780||150 nF)

You can configure the above using OBiTALK 's OBi Expert.


I did exactly that, I changed the value in the "ACImpedance" and then asked my relatives to call (via their land line-in another location and cell phone) the phone number that the Romania-Obi is connected to.  Still did not get the attendent.   

Do I need to perhaps change the "ACimpedance" value to something else and/or change other values within the Obi Expert menus in a similar manner as suggested in the post titled "OBi Down Under: Australia OBi100 and OBi110 Config / Set-up" by ShermanObi?  If so, then what would the new changes be?? and where would they be??

Also, please note that I have no knowledge of what the numerical values mean in the "ACimpedance" or other values within the Obi Expert menus.  I simply followed directions of the support team.  Please provide answer/help with the assumption that I am just beginning to understand the potential of the Obi and how to modify the values to maximize its use!

Thanks in advance for your help and answer.  I need for my relatives to be able to get to the OBI attendant in Romania via their cell phone or another land line (away from the Romania Obi) so they can then use the option #2 to call the U.S Obi.

I have attached a screen shot of the "ACimpedance" with the adjusted value as suggessted by the support team.

Best Regards.

Stewart

I don't believe that your issue has anything to do with impedance.

You would need to set the LINE port on the Romania OBi to route some or all calls to the AA.  If the connected landline has caller ID, you can set it up so only specific callers get the AA.  Or, you can set it up so if the home phone is unanswered, the AA picks up after a delay.  Or, you could have all calls answered by the AA (a caller would press 1 to ring the home phone).  See pages 121-122 of the OBi Device Administration Guide, or search this forum for Inbound Call Route examples.

jeetco

Stewart,
Thanks for the quick reply!--much appreciated!!
Q-1: Shall I change the "ACimpedance" back to the original setting of 600 (i believe), since you think that may not be the issue.  Please note that, the change in the "ACimpedance" value was what was originally suggested by the support team.
Q-2: The cell phone number as well as the residential number (in another location from the Romania-Obi) are listed within the "Trusted Callers".  So, by all accounts, should not the Obi Attendant answer when the call comes in from that romania residential or cell phone line?
Q-3. For setting it up "so if the home phone is unanswered, the AA picks up after a delay", please can you tell me how would I write that in the "inbound call route" menu--I am new at this!.  For this feature to work, caller ID feature needs to be present, correct?
Q-4.  If they do not have caller ID, then I would have to set up the OBI so all calls go to the attendent.  If that happens, since this OBI is at a business location, I would have to set up voice prompts in the Romanian language for strangers to dial 1 to go directly to the phone attached to the OBI but keep the other two options "secret" so only my family can use option #2 to call my OBI here in the U.S.  So, now I am getting deeper and deeper into this and need to know how to set up custom voice prompts within the Romania-OBI (in Romanian language) and how to keep option #2 "secret".

Thanks in advance for your help and helping me learn the tremendous potential of this device!!

Stewart

Sorry for the confusing reply -- your original post said nothing about Trusted Callers, so I assumed that was the issue.

The impedance setting recommended by OBi should be left in place, as it will reduce echo problems, as well as improving reliability of caller ID detection (which was why OBi suggested it).

If the landline doesn't have caller ID service, this scheme won't work.  I don't recommend sending all calls via the attendant, if we can find an alternate solution.

Assuming caller ID is available, what gets logged in the OBi's Call History after a call failed to reach the AA?  If no number is shown, we can work on caller ID detection.  If the number shown does not match what you have in Trusted Callers (e.g. it includes the country code), change the Trusted Caller list accordingly.  If it does match, try increasing RingDelay for the LINE port from 4000 to 6000.

If your Trusted Callers can call 031 (national) numbers at little or no additional cost, using Localphone (instead of the RO OBi) to relay calls may be a good solution.  What services do you presently have set up on the US OBi?

jeetco

Stewart,

Once again thanks for the quick replies...awesome support.

Last night I had my relatives in Romania call the Romania-OBI from their Romania-Cell.  As they were calling I looked in the Obi "call history".  The number does not show up.  I was told that they have caller ID. But, then I asked the person to call from his cell to a telephone on that same line that would give him a read out of what the caller ID screen on that phone shows.  Well, when he called nothing showed up on the screen of the phone.  So, it seems that he does NOT have caller ID afterall on that line.  I have asked him to call the phone company (Rom Telecom) to see about getting caller ID on that line.

Initally, I bought the Obis to talk exclusively with the relatives in Romania--got to cut down on the bills.
I had been using Ooma service for about a year before I found out about the Obi.  I pay the $100/year to get their additional services.  I have the Obi connected to the Ooma.  But I have read the forum on how easy it is to port my residential line to T-Mobile to Google voice that next year I will just go with Obi exclusively.  I have learned a lot more what the Obi is capable off, so my confidence with Obi and working with it is growing considerably.

Please keep this post open till I am able to confirm that the calls from Romania cell/residential phone to romania-obi to romania-obi-attendant to U.S obi works after my relatives are able to get Rom Telecom to provide them with the caller ID feature on their office land line (which is connected to the Romania-Obi).

Stewart

IMO there is probably a good way to make this work without caller ID on the RO landline, using Localphone or Rebtel.

Please report what services you have presently set up on each OBi.  Also, tell me about the economics:  What is cost from their cell to the existing landline?  From cell to an 031 number?  From landline to cell?

jeetco

Stewart,

Make this work without caller id?!!  that would be fantastic...but how?!! by using Localphone or Rebtel...but how?!!?!!

The Obi that I have in the U.S is connected to the Ooma.  I will use the Obi to specifically call Romania-Obi and then to Romania cell phone or Romania Residential line.
I plan to get rid of my Ooma service next year, when my $100 membership expires, port my number to GV and use Obi for all my calls within the U.S and countries other than Romania.

The Obi in Romania, at this moment will get calls from us in the U.S and be used to "jump" to the cell phone or residential line in Romania.  I also wish to have them call us from their cell phone/residential line to romania-obi to U.S obi.

I have asked my relatives to let me know what the costs are for dialing from their cell to the existing landline, from cell to an 031 number and from landline to cell.  I am told that the service there is awful...operators dont necessary know the answers or the customers are on hold for a long time and then they are hung up on.  They will just wait for their bill and let me know what the costs are on their office land line and I will report back!!

Stewart

The basic idea behind companies such as Localphone and Rebtel is simple: you call a local number in your country and it directly rings your contact in another country; your prepaid account with them is charged at reasonable per-minute rates.  The way it works is that they have a small block of numbers (usually 8 to 20) in each city they serve.  They use your caller ID to know which account to charge, and which number (in the block) you call tells them which contact to ring.  Several other companies do the same thing, e.g. Zenofon and Fonworld, but they have access numbers in only one or two countries.  Localphone and Rebtel can also be used as regular calling card or VoIP providers and they have other "tricks" as well.

If you sign up with Localphone (you get five minutes free credit for testing), you can set up a relative's number in RO as "your" number and your own Ooma and/or US cell number as the contact(s).  Under Local Numbers, set your Location to Bucharest and you'll see an 0318 number for each contact.  If the relative dials that number, it will ring your Ooma or cell line.  The cost to a US number is $0.005/min.

So far, that has nothing to do with OBi.  The next step is to get a SIP account for your US OBi, e.g. Callcentric, VoIP.ms, Localphone, or another that provides a free iNum.  Set up your iNum as a Contact in Localphone, and your relative can now ring your OBi at no charge to you.  With proper OBi configuration, you could also bridge the call via GV to your cell, or allow them access to the AA to call anywhere.

For the above to make economic sense, calls to the 0318 numbers have to be cheap.  I would guess that from a cell phone, it's just regular airtime (though that may itself be costly).  From a landline, I have no idea.  However, if it's expensive, you can set up a callback system instead.  Since Localphone will pass your relative's caller ID, the OBi can recognize it and not answer immediately.  When the caller hangs up (not being charged for the unanswered call), the OBi AA calls back.  Your relative can then press 2 and dial the desired number, or press 1 to ring your OBi.  There is presumably no cost to receive a call on RO cell or landline phone.  Of course, for that to make economic sense, you need an inexpensive route for the callback, hence my question of what it costs to call from the RO landline.  If that, too, is expensive, a SIP provider will be the best choice.  The Betamax companies are generally the cheapest, see http://backsla.sh/betamax for a list.  Quality is generally not the best, but if you will be doing lots of minutes it's worth putting up €5 to experiment.  Voxbeam (Premium route), another brand of Localphone, is usually excellent quality, but there are some gotchas.  They give you $1 test credit at signup.

jeetco

Stewart,
I sent you a reply at 12:30am and you respond at around 3am—the same day!  Can't thank you enough for the support, but don't you get any sleep!! –sure appreciate you, Stewart!

Well, I signed up on Localphone.  I did set up the relative's number as "my" number and have listed my U.S residential (presently with Ooma) number as a "contact".  Localphone has assigned a local Bucharest number connected to my U.S (ooma)  number.

Then, per your instructions, I procured an iNum from Localphone.  Now, that iNum in Localphone which is also set up as a contact in the same account, has also been assigned a local Bucharest number, which is slightly different than the one assigned to my U.S (Ooma) residential line.
 
i.e. Both the numbers:  iNum and my U.S  (Ooma) residential  number are listed as the "contacts" within the one account that I set up -- as mentioned in the second paragraph.  Each one of these "contacts" have been assigned slightly separate Bucharest numbers.

The procured iNum has 3 options.  1. to forward calls to "internet phone" (no charge), 2. To forward calls to a land line (charge) and 3. Forward calls to local phone voicemail. 
Presently the iNum is set up to forward to the "internet phone" which is a #-7 digit number.

This is where I get stuck! 

How will my relative call me on the iNum and get to my U.S Obi??  I am wondering -- if my relative dials the local Bucharest number connected to the iNum, it will get forwarded to the #-7 digit "internet phone" number and then that call would have nowhere to go!  If I do forward the "iNum–connected-Bucharest-local-number" to my "U.S-residential-line-bucharest-local-number" then there is a charge to that call.
I am just trying to achieve the result of what you commented "Set up your iNum as a Contact in Localphone, and your relative can now ring your OBi at no charge to you"

Also, once I have achieved this with Localphone, you say that I "could allow access to my U.S AA to call anywhere"—would I then be charged the fees when my relatives use my U.S Obi AA to call anywhere?

carl

 From what I see I do not think the  i-num will do much for you, unless you want to forward the calls from there for 0.5c/min. You could also get an US DID from Localphone( they have now a special with no sign up fee) and set up your Obi with Localphone as a second provider. That' what I have ( I have some issues with Localphone voice mail, though.).

jeetco

Carl,

Thanks for the reply.  Yes, the iNum suggestion that Stewart has talked about has gotten me stumped for the moment!  I think Stewart may still have a valid answer about what he said in this post: "Set up your iNum as a Contact in Localphone, and your relative can now ring your OBi at no charge to you".  Hope Stewart gets to look at what I wrote and lets see what he has to say!

Best Regards!

Stewart

If the SP2 slot of your US OBi is not presently used, just set it up for your Localphone account.  If it's in use for Callcentric, VoIP.ms or another provider that offers iNum, use that iNum for your Localphone Contact.  If it's filled with something else, please explain; there is probably a workaround.

Once routed to the US OBi, you can have the calls ring the PHONE port (free), or be answered by the auto attendant, from where they could call out (on GV, Ooma or other service you have set up on the OBi).  Of course, if you permit them to call destinations not included in your plan with the service in question, you will be billed for the calls.

BTW, our winter home is in Bangkok (UTC + 7 hours), which partly explains my posting at odd times.  But, as a retired old fart, I tend to keep strange hours, too.

jeetco

Stewart!  Must be nice to move around in another part of the world for the winter!!  For you to be there and still be able to provide superb support to the OBI community is much appreciated!! For you to be retired and know about all this technology is admirable.  I am in my 40's and I feel like an "old fart" compared to you--I am just learning this stuff--where have I been??!!

Well, the SP2 slot of my U.S Obi is available and I will set up my localphone account per your instructions in an older post titled "Not able to setup LocalPhone on SP2" (http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=1731.0).  Please note that my LocalPhone account is set up as if it were in Romania where I set up the relative's number as "my" number and have listed my U.S residential number as a "contact".
Question 1: By configuring the localphone account in the Obi per your instructions in that older post, will the Obi recognize the calls made to the "local romanian number" that has been assigned to the "iNum" number? or will the Obi recognize the "internet number" that the calls are being forwarded to presently from the "iNum"?

Question 2: What I am also just trying to understand is that how does a phone call from Romania get routed via localphone into my Obi in the U.S if the only forwarding number for my iNum right now is the internet phone number.

Stewart

To set up SP2 for Localphone, use the 7-digit SIP ID and 8-character SIP Password shown on Localphone's Internet Phone tab.  Confirm that the System Status page of your OBi shows SP2 as Registered.  You can make a test outgoing call on Localphone by prefixing **2 to specify SP2.  Calls to US toll-free numbers are free (though if you have not yet funded your Localphone account, be aware that they still count against your five free test minutes).  For example, if you dial **218004377950, you should hear the caller ID being sent by Localphone.

Next, with your iNum set to forward to Internet Phone, test by calling (from your cell or Ooma) an iNum gateway http://inum.net/what-is-inum/voice-reach/ .  When you hear the "Welcome to iNum" prompt, dial the last nine digits of your iNum, followed by #.  You should hear "connecting" and your OBi phone should ring.  Answer it and confirm that you have audio in both directions.

If you get that far, then your relative should be able to call the Localphone number that corresponds to your iNum and it should ring your OBi phone.  Once you've had a successful call, check the Call History to see how the relative's caller ID was formatted (it might include the country code and/or a leading zero).

Once you know the incoming caller ID, you can set up the InboundCallRoute for SP2 to allow the relative to access the auto attendant, fork the call to your cell phone, or provide other desired special treatment.

igroup

Hi Jeetco,

Interesting topic, even more since I am interesting in the same thing - did not tried it yet.
Here is how far I got:

I - USA
They - Romania

OBI only in USA, since I could not figure out how to or who to talk to in order to get a personal line In Romania (got relatives there but don't want to use theirs) that could provide calls unlimited across Romania landline / cell for a monthly fixed fee (EG MagicJack, Nettalk).

I have 3 OBI's here in USA an I am EXTREMELLY happy with them. Also, on them I have GV, MJ and Nettalk.
Romania does calls here once in a while - I have a Romanian DID setup on a different ATA - for me, incoming is free and for them is a local call. But I am interested in being able to call them most of the time. Since I couldn't find a way to "purchase" a local line, let's say in Bucharest to offer for a fixed monthly fee all my needed internal calls, make no sens to send an OBI in Romania (although I could, since I could have where to).

In this moment, cheapest way for myself for outbound Romania is using one dedicated OBI, SP1 with SIP at 12voip.com and SP2 with SIP at rynga.com - both offer great rates and some FREE landline calls - some rules apply, but there is a work around (PS - I know they are the same company, just trying to get 300 min / week free landline on each).

Got a few questions for your OBI setup in Romania:

What are you using to make calls in Romania - their PSTN Line ? What does cost you?
Is there a GV setup on OBI Romania, or all calls from Romania to USA are made through OBI end points?
Any more tricks that you could share to get this back and forward calls USA / Romania to minimum cost?


PS - I use one of my OBI's for Business. I had it nicely setup and the Auto Attendant will pick up all my calls. Calls will be redirected afterwards. Original settings in AA 1, 2, 3 are hidden, and work great for myself. I know the risk I'm involved in, like someone making calls on my account, but so far, never got even closer to that. One thing is that I ONLY accept caller ID, so I'll still be able to track down whoever tried that. If Localphone or other settings don't work for you, you could give this a try. Also, you could look into getting a Romanian DID where they can call you directle, maybe they can leave a message then you can call them back via OBI.

Thanks - just sharing my thoughts and trying to gain some more usefull info.

Stewart

Quote from: igroup on January 18, 2012, 08:31:14 PMI have a Romanian DID setup on a different ATA - for me, incoming is free and for them is a local call.
I am curious: Who is the supplier?  What does it cost?  Is it a real geographic number or an 031 (national)?   If geographic, did you have to verify your address in Romania?  If an 031, does that cost more than a geographic number for your relatives to call?

If you make lots of calls to RO mobiles, I noticed that Voxbeam has seems-too-good-to-be true rates to a few of the carriers; if that's what your folks are using, you may want to give them a try.

Also, if you can get a cell plan there with unlimited or lots of minutes for a reasonable cost, setting up a GSM gateway at a relative's home may be your best bet.

jeetco

Igroup, thanks for your input!  Originally my purchase of the Obi's was simple.  Get two obi's.  Connect one Obi in the U.S, the other at my Romania relative's home and we have free phone calls—that's it.  That was my goal.  Little did I know that I would soon be on the road to understanding terms such as DID, PSTN, SIP, SP1, SP2, etc, etc...!  The internet connection to the Romania apartment is a cat-5 cable coming into the apartment from a router somewhere in the building.  They can only connect the cat-5 to the computer and then they have to run the proprietary internet company software on the computer to request the internet connection.  So, the Obi could not be installed there.  We then decided to install the Obi at his own office because he has a router set up there.  So now we make calls from my U.S-obi to the Romania-office-Obi to the Romania-apartment or cell.  My relative get's charged the local call charge made from Romania-office-Obi to Romania-apartment (charges not known yet, will find out when the bill shows up).  Calls at this time cannot be made from Romania-apartment to Romania-office-Obi to U.S-Obi simply because Romania-office line does not have caller ID. –Hope this clears things for you.

Just as Stewart asked, who is the supplier of your Romanian DID, what does it cost? etc.
...and just as Stewart suggested, a GSM gateway would be an answer...to have it the relatives home.

Stewart, thanks for turning me onto Voxbeam!!—you are a Rockstar!!!—the rates are truly CHEAP.  And they are cheap to India -- another place of interest for me to make calls.

So, question to you my friend, how do I set up Voxbeam to work on Obi??!!—is it similar to Localphone?

I will be setting up Localphone on the U.S-Obi tonight.  Will let you know how it all goes!

jeetco

Stewart!  Success!!
I set up the Localphone just as you asked me to--My relative called the local phone number (in romania) associated with my iNum and the call came thru to me, in the U.S, with NO charge to me.  Now, it seems that the local phone number (in Romania) that has been assigned to my iNum could be in the same network as the phone number they are on, simply because they both start with 031...now if they are on the same network then their charge is minimal and after 6pm Romania time, I am told the call is free to them!!  My relative will be getting me the call charges once he is able to talk to a customer service agent that has the aptitude to provide him with the info. He actually said it's easier to just wait for the bill and see the charges then.  Now that this has been achieved, I am on to my next venture...
1. to set up the Romania-Obi with Localphone or with Voxbeam so they can call their relatives in Greece and Australia....
2. and also setup my U.S Obi to call India and use voxbeam or another service.

carl

.
2. and also setup my U.S Obi to call India and use voxbeam or another service.
[/quote]
I am a bit confused here  thought Voxbeam's discount pricing was only for wholesalers/re sellers ???

Stewart

Quote from: carl on January 20, 2012, 04:48:50 PMI am a bit confused here  thought Voxbeam's discount pricing was only for wholesalers/re sellers ???
Voxbeam (and also FlowRoute and Bandwidth.com) are like Costco or Sam's Club -- though nominally "wholesale", they have lots of small customers, using the service personally or for their business.

Voxbeam does have a few gotchas.  Once you have exhausted the free $1 test credit, the minimum payment is $50.  If not topped up, credit expires after one year, so it's only useful if you are spending more than $4 monthly.  Also, there is a 2.5% surcharge for payment by credit card or paypal.  You can avoid that by using the electronic bill pay service (ACH transfer) that you may have with your bank, broker or credit union.

Voxbeam athenticates by IP address.  If yours changes frequently, I have a script that will update the site automatically, which I'll post if anyone is interested.

Voice Gateway 1 is set up in my OBi for Voxbeam.  For outbound caller ID of 12123456789, set AccessNumber to SP2(sbc.voxbeam.com;ui=12123456789;op=ns)  and also put 12123456789 in AuthUserID.  For the PHONE Port DigitMap, add |**3(Msp2) after **2(Msp2) and add to OutboundCallRoute ,{(<**3:>(Msp2)):vg1} after {(<**2:>(Msp2)):sp2}

At this point, it should be possible (from the phone attached to the OBi) to dial e.g. **318004377950 and reach 18004377950 via Voxbeam (if done correctly, the caller ID that you set will be read back to you).

An analogous modification to the AA settings would allow using Voxbeam from the AA, also with the **3 prefix.

To avoid the prefix, you can make additional digit map changes to send calls to specific numbers or certain countries via Voxbeam.  Or, set your speed dials to use VG1 as desired.