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Author Topic: Callcentric and Google Voice Setup Guide (with CNAM)  (Read 584772 times)
SteveInWA
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« Reply #200 on: October 02, 2014, 06:08:30 pm »

Note that DSLReports user "Iscream" apparently works for Callcentric.  His posts get a bit testy and defensive, but understandably so.  CC has gone out of their way to help explain and diagnose it.  He points to what I am pursuing with Google at this time; a possible problem with what he calls an "aggregator", or transit carrier.  

In simpler terms, someone calls your Google Voice number.  Next, Google is not a regulated telephone company (CLEC).  So, it buys telephone network services from a variety of carriers, both to terminate numbers (host them on a phone switch, so that it can be called by other numbers), and to transport the forwarded outbound calls to your forwarding phone numbers' destinations.  So at this point, Google's system then selects a transit carrier to send the call to your Callcentric DID.  We think that the CID / CNAM is getting altered in that path, before it reaches CC.

On a related note, Iscream describes the business and technical decisions that CC has made to make call quality and reliability a priority, at some added expense over the competition.  There's been a lot of focus here on this forum on finding the very cheapest internet telephone service provider, with some charging much lower per-minute rates.  This is an example of "you get what you pay for".  I've been accused of being a shill for CC, but I simply appreciate their approach, and support it with my business.  Other folks may be satisfied with a lower-priced solution; to each his/her own.

Google, by the way, does use multiple carriers, but its focus is also on reliability and call quality, and it is doing a lot of work internally to optimize both those things.

Again, I don't know if or when I can get this fixed, but I'm devoting some time and resources now to focusing on it.

I posted an update today, over in the service provider section; if you would like to help test and report back, please do so on that thread:

http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=8750.msg57793#msg57793

Tl;DR:  Google worked with the carrier that was causing the GV-->Callcentric caller ID failure, and they fixed it today.

Rick appears to have a different issue, and I've asked him to open a new post over on the GV forum so we can troubleshoot it (his inbound GV number isn't working at all).
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Rick
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« Reply #201 on: October 03, 2014, 04:33:02 am »

It appears that all my issues are now gone.  They still existed as of 8:30 EST last night, but are now resolved.
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #202 on: October 03, 2014, 04:36:54 am »

Well, whaddaya know.  Glad to hear that, Rick; enjoy!
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Rick
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« Reply #203 on: October 03, 2014, 04:39:41 am »

Enjoy?   Cheesy

Thanks for your help Steve.  Hopefully, going forward GV will be more reliable.  I hadn't had any issues for a very long time, then it started getting ridiculous.  For what I pay, it should be better...   Grin
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #204 on: October 03, 2014, 04:41:22 am »

I say, it's worth every penny you pay!  Wink
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SedonaSky
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« Reply #205 on: October 08, 2014, 11:49:11 am »

Are the instructions at the beginning of this thread still the most accurate (two years later)?
http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=3640.msg24230#msg24230

Do we still need to pay the $1.50 per month for caller Id?

Or is there a more recent page or forum thread?

Many Thanks
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Rick
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« Reply #206 on: October 08, 2014, 02:19:45 pm »

Steve -

Back to not working.  I sent you PM.
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #207 on: October 08, 2014, 05:20:48 pm »

Steve -

Back to not working.  I sent you PM.

Hi Rick:  I responded to your message -- let's collect some call data and find the failure.  Thanks.
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Rick
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« Reply #208 on: October 08, 2014, 05:33:36 pm »

I can do that in AM, but you already gave the GV number and the CC number.  Calls were between 3:53 and 4:09 then around 5.

On voice forum there were many with similar issues.
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #209 on: October 08, 2014, 07:47:36 pm »

I can do that in AM, but you already gave the GV number and the CC number.  Calls were between 3:53 and 4:09 then around 5.

On voice forum there were many with similar issues.

Yes, I have a now-closed bug report with Google, that had to do with incorrect or missing caller ID.  Your issue, as I understand it, is that the calls aren't even getting forwarded.  That's a different bug.  I will now open a new report with Google on that.  So, please be patient, and help us diagnose it, by working with the Google Voice Forum system, which is the best way to track and work a problem with Google engineering.

Open a new post on the GV Help Forum.  Refer to our conversation here.  Mention that this is on your GV number.  List a few new (within 24 hours) sample calls with the L4D of the calling number and the timestamp.  Once I have this, it is easy to get dedicated attention to your specific account and your call history.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2014, 03:53:27 am by SteveInWA » Logged

SedonaSky
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« Reply #210 on: October 10, 2014, 09:11:24 pm »

Is Rick's problem specific to him or is everybody having intermmittant problems?

Can someone please reply to the questions from this post: http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=3640.msg58076#msg58076

Thank you
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #211 on: October 10, 2014, 09:38:10 pm »

Is Rick's problem specific to him or is everybody having intermmittant problems?

Can someone please reply to the questions from this post: http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=3640.msg58076#msg58076

Thank you

Those original instructions include some outdated information, and some unnecessary steps on the local OBi device interface. 

Rather than rehash the 2-year old instructions in an 11-page thread, or try to discuss your issue in the context of those instructions, what, exactly is your current problem?

Big picture:
  • Google Voice is now supported on OBi devices via a different, more secure authentication method, which is now officially approved by Google.  Instructions on configuring your OBi using the new process are here:  http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=8560.msg56460#msg56460
  • As an alternative, if you want to take advantage of caller ID name service, via an inbound Callcentric phone number, you can add that CC forwarding number to your Google Voice account, disable direct inbound calls via Google Chat/OBi, and set up the CC number on a Service Provider slot on your OBi.
  • In this scenario, you can, for example, use GV on SP1 as your default for OUTbound calls, and CC on SP2 as your default for INbound calls AND for E911 service.
  • If you do this, you will pay CC $1.50/month for E911 service.
  • Configuring the OBi for both GV and CC can be easily performed, using the OBiTALK portal pages; there is no need to use the OBi local web page interface for this purpose.

There was a recurring problem regarding caller ID being lost or displayed incorrectly on calls forwarded from Google Voice to numbers owned by Callcentric's own carrier, Telengy.  That problem was fixed last week.  There is a remaining, related problem that is intermittently happening with that same call path, causing delays or failures of forwarded calls reaching Telengy DIDs.  I'm working on that right now with Rick and with Google engineering.  I don't have an estimated time to resolve it, but I am optimistic, since the error data Rick supplied clearly aligns with carrier log data.  Google is now working with the carriers to diagnose and resolve the failures.
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Wildcatz
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« Reply #212 on: February 03, 2015, 10:08:40 am »

Hi All
Seeing an interesting issue with Google Voice & Callcentric that led me to start a thread over @ Google yesterday. Specifically the issue I was seeing initially was that Private/Anonymous calls were being dumped into Google Voicemail even though all calls and groups were set to forward to my Callcentric number. After trying to isolate this yesterday (I tried many configurations and changes on both sides) I found that this erroneous routing was being caused by call treatments on my Callcentric account. Specifically if I set a call treatment to allow the Callcentric phone to ring (blocked or unblocked number) irregardless then sure enough the call routed through fine. However if I used ANY call treatment on the Callcentric end to say go straight to voicemail, send the call to another number, perform the telemarketer block etc the call would always default route to Google Voice voicemail and never be passed to Callcentric.

I know Callcentric are very aware of the issues with Google Voice and I raised a ticket as well (great Callcentric tech support as usual BTW) but what was strange to me is this has been working with my paid Callcentric DID for a long while. Also of interest was that yesterday when I was playing with the Google Voice account settings I actually got the call to be passed through once and then it never worked again even though the settings remained constant.

Just wondering if anyone else has seen this specific issue, knows of a workaround and if trying to do something at the hardware level, like use an OBI to bind Google Voice to 1 path and Callcentric to the other would allow some way of getting over this issue ?

Like many others I like having the Google Voice number as an intermediary if you will, something that you put on membership forms etc just in case telemarketers start to call Smiley So if others have another option to resolve this (maybe use a free DID and bind that ?) then I would appreciate the feedback as well.

Thanks and hope this was a good place to post this, didn't want to hijack the thread but this seemed very similar to issues I was seeing, Callcentric & Google Voice.

WC
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Taoman
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« Reply #213 on: February 03, 2015, 12:02:35 pm »

However if I used ANY call treatment on the Callcentric end to say go straight to voicemail, send the call to another number, perform the telemarketer block etc the call would always default route to Google Voice voicemail and never be passed to Callcentric.

I'm curious how you know this to be true? Have you actually looked at the Callcentric logs to make sure the call isn't actually being forwarded to Callcentric but that it just keeps ringing until GV voicemail picks up?

Google Voice doesn't support early media. Most of the Callcentric call treatments use early media. To test, make a Callcentric call treatment that currently isn't working with Google Voice. Then call your Callcentric DID directly (bypassing Google Voice) and what happens? It should work.
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Wildcatz
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« Reply #214 on: February 03, 2015, 05:00:47 pm »

Thanks of your reply, I did try call treatment setup with tests made direct to the Callcentric number and they worked as expected. It appears to be the transport(s) between Google Voice and their carrier(s) and Callcentric which is a shame as like I said something appears to have changed as this was working fine to my paid Callcentric DID before. Call centric are their usual helpful and resourceful selves and certainly appreciate them looking into this too.
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #215 on: February 03, 2015, 06:51:45 pm »

I found that this erroneous routing was being caused by call treatments on my Callcentric account. Specifically if I set a call treatment to allow the Callcentric phone to ring (blocked or unblocked number) irregardless then sure enough the call routed through fine. However if I used ANY call treatment on the Callcentric end to say go straight to voicemail, send the call to another number, perform the telemarketer block etc the call would always default route to Google Voice voicemail and never be passed to Callcentric.

Hi: 

You and I went through a series of posts on this topic on the GV help forum.  The bottom line, regardless of what might have worked in the past, is that the type of call treatments you are attempting to perform on the CC end, should just be performed on the GV end instead.

I can tell you that I have a GV number forwarded to a CC DID, and that the following call treatments do work:

  • Send certain specific inbound numbers (telemarketer/fraudster/spammer) to the no-service SIT error message (create one such treatment for each number that calls you, and you want to block in the future.  If the caller isn't handled by these rules, then the default rule is processed:
  • Send to one, or multiple extensions, and ring each for 30 seconds, then go to CC VM (this should be your only call treatment set as the default for calls made to this DID, and be sure to click the "normalize priority" button after you finish adding treatments.)

Do NOT create any treatments to try to subsequently forward the call to a different phone number, after it hits your CC DID.

The purpose of setting the "forward to CC VM after 30 seconds" is as a GV-compatible fail-safe:  GV will ring a forwarded number for approximately 25 seconds, then, if no answer or busy, it will give up and take back the call to GV VM.  The 30 second ring interval for CC will prevent CC VM from grabbing the calls before GV VM.  However, if someone calls the CC DID directly, the unanswered call will instead go to CC VM.
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Taoman
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« Reply #216 on: February 03, 2015, 07:57:57 pm »


  • Send certain specific inbound numbers (telemarketer/fraudster/spammer) to the no-service SIT error message (create one such treatment for each number that calls you, and you want to block in the future.  If the caller isn't handled by these rules, then the default rule is processed:

Are you saying the caller literally hears the SIT error message or that the caller just hears a ringback tone until GV voicemail picks up? When I try this (and I've tested this dozens of times) there is no message heard (since it is early media) just the ringback tone.

And I'm not sure why you would recommend making individual call treatments "for each number that calls you, and you want to block in the future." That seems needlessly redundant. Why not make one or two call treatments and make corresponding phone book groups the call treatments act on? Then just add the "telemarketer/fraudster/spammer" contact to one of those groups.
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Wildcatz
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« Reply #217 on: February 03, 2015, 08:28:48 pm »

Hi Steve

Thanks for the continued pointers, I too am trying some new things and doing some further digging as well. What was interesting is that when I have the call treatments on (simple one right now that takes inbound calls from my google voice number and should send to CC vmail) although I still get pushed to Google Voice mail instead of CC, I am seeing the call show up in the callcentric history report log, therefore a part of this call seems to be registering with Callcentric even though the call seemingly bounces or is pulled back to Google Voice voicemail. I will try the 30 second VMail config now that you mentioned and see what that gives me.

With regards to the call treatment for every call you wish to block in future I was hoping instead I could do like I do with Callcentric direct which is force the Telemarketer option on any private/anonymous calls that originate from my Google Voice number, I know I can set this up in the CC treatments but of course today it appears to be the addition of these treatments that is not letting the call make the final piece of the connect.


I found that this erroneous routing was being caused by call treatments on my Callcentric account. Specifically if I set a call treatment to allow the Callcentric phone to ring (blocked or unblocked number) irregardless then sure enough the call routed through fine. However if I used ANY call treatment on the Callcentric end to say go straight to voicemail, send the call to another number, perform the telemarketer block etc the call would always default route to Google Voice voicemail and never be passed to Callcentric.

Hi: 

You and I went through a series of posts on this topic on the GV help forum.  The bottom line, regardless of what might have worked in the past, is that the type of call treatments you are attempting to perform on the CC end, should just be performed on the GV end instead.

I can tell you that I have a GV number forwarded to a CC DID, and that the following call treatments do work:

  • Send certain specific inbound numbers (telemarketer/fraudster/spammer) to the no-service SIT error message (create one such treatment for each number that calls you, and you want to block in the future.  If the caller isn't handled by these rules, then the default rule is processed:
  • Send to one, or multiple extensions, and ring each for 30 seconds, then go to CC VM (this should be your only call treatment set as the default for calls made to this DID, and be sure to click the "normalize priority" button after you finish adding treatments.)

Do NOT create any treatments to try to subsequently forward the call to a different phone number, after it hits your CC DID.

The purpose of setting the "forward to CC VM after 30 seconds" is as a GV-compatible fail-safe:  GV will ring a forwarded number for approximately 25 seconds, then, if no answer or busy, it will give up and take back the call to GV VM.  The 30 second ring interval for CC will prevent CC VM from grabbing the calls before GV VM.  However, if someone calls the CC DID directly, the unanswered call will instead go to CC VM.
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giqcass
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« Reply #218 on: February 03, 2015, 08:33:54 pm »

And I'm not sure why you would recommend making individual call treatments "for each number that calls you, and you want to block in the future." That seems needlessly redundant. Why not make one or two call treatments and make corresponding phone book groups the call treatments act on? Then just add the "telemarketer/fraudster/spammer" contact to one of those groups.
Yes much simpler to use as few call treatment as possible to avoid confusion.  In addition with CC you can even block/whitelist entire area codes if you like.

I started a thread on call treatments here. This thread wasn't really about that in the beginning.
http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=9406.0
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #219 on: February 03, 2015, 08:35:10 pm »


  • Send certain specific inbound numbers (telemarketer/fraudster/spammer) to the no-service SIT error message (create one such treatment for each number that calls you, and you want to block in the future.  If the caller isn't handled by these rules, then the default rule is processed:

Are you saying the caller literally hears the SIT error message or that the caller just hears a ringback tone until GV voicemail picks up? When I try this (and I've tested this dozens of times) there is no message heard (since it is early media) just the ringback tone.

And I'm not sure why you would recommend making individual call treatments "for each number that calls you, and you want to block in the future." That seems needlessly redundant. Why not make one or two call treatments and make corresponding phone book groups the call treatments act on? Then just add the "telemarketer/fraudster/spammer" contact to one of those groups.

Your mileage may vary.  My personal use case is that I have 4 different Callcentric DIDs on my one Callcentric account.  Two of the four numbers are forwarding targets for GV; the other two are just numbers not used with GV.  I get my fair share of junk phone calls to one or more of those DIDs.  So, when get an inbound call as I did the other day, from some clown threatening to issue a warrant for my arrest if I didn't respond to a order from a Federal magistrate, I add a call treatment to block that number.  I hadn't thought of creating a phone book for those callers.  

If the caller is calling the CC DID directly, they'll hear the SIT and recorded message.  

If the caller is calling GV, AND GV's own global spam list doesn't happen to catch the caller, AND you haven't blocked that caller in GV, and a CC call treatment to send them to the SIT and recorded error message is enabled, then the caller will hear ringing, while GV tries to simulring other forwarding targets (e.g. Hangouts or Chat), but GV will give up on the CC number after it hears the SIT, and the CC phone number won't ring (so, like you said, the caller won't hear the SIT, but the end result will be that you won't be bothered).  Since the vast majority of spam calls are made by robocalling systems, they usually hang up before leaving a message.

This is by design.  Since GV is designed to simulring all forwarding numbers, and intelligently handle the response from each number during the ring interval, it intentionally doesn't play the SIT to the caller.  Think about it:  up to six forwarding numbers, plus Chat, plus Hangouts are all being sent the call at once.  Whichever destination is capable of answering the call first, will get the call.  You wouldn't want one of those numbers to interfere with the others being able to answer the call, and you, the caller, wouldn't want to hear some sort of cacophony of all the numbers either ringing, or playing a busy signal or SIT.

So, as I said, call handling is more effectively processed at the first hop (GV), but adding CC call treatments is an effective alternative that won't cause any problems.  Other call treatments may or may not interfere with GV; use at your own risk.
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