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Author Topic: Google adding official calling on there mobile version of Hangouts:  (Read 13143 times)
Crow550
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« on: October 19, 2013, 02:40:31 pm »

http://www.engadget.com/2013/10/18/google-hangouts-ios-phone-calls-online-status-google-voice/

So Hangouts on PC and Mobile (iOS now and Android when 4.4 releases) offers calling in and out. That means no more 3rd party apps will be needed.

So how will this change the way voip devices work? Will the Obi device be able to use the Hangouts API? Will this offer any new quality improvements or features?
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2013, 07:54:22 pm »

So how will this change the way voip devices work?

It doesn't change anything at this time.  It's only a feature added to Google's own Hangouts mobile application.  It neither adds nor removes any capabilities for third-party VoIP hardware or software that are currently using XMPP to interact with Google Voice.  General comments have been made in the past with regard to "sunsetting" XMPP support, but at this time, that has not happened, and there is no publicly-announced plan to do so.  Google is more focused on expanding the user base for Hangouts at the moment, then it is on shutting down any other functions.

Will the Obi device be able to use the Hangouts API?

That's the important question, and there has been no public information shared on this, nor do I expect there will be, until (or unless) that feature is released to the public.

Will this offer any new quality improvements or features?

The features added are those that have been added to the Google Hangouts app itself.  What's significant, is that the various third party apps, such as Talkatone, GrooVeIP, Mo+, Phone+, GV Phone, etc, will become unnecessary.  What's interesting, is that the Hangouts software contains licensed or open support for a wide variety of audio and video CODECs, which may offer better call quality over WiFi than the current, G.711-only support via Google Chat.  It's irrelevant to OBi at this time, since XMPP support is still unchanged and available.

Google remains publicly committed to Google Voice and Hangouts, and I expect that near-future development will focus on adding and integrating more functionality to Hangouts.  Beyond that, Google doesn't comment on future plans.
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ElForesto
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« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2013, 04:13:29 pm »

Apparently Google is getting ready to play hardball with third-party GV devs: http://www.androidcentral.com/google-voice-won-t-be-integrated-latest-hangouts-update-it-s-coming

Quote
Going further, Google Voice is going to get notably more secure with changes to the ways third-party apps have access to the service. Developers who currently violate the Google Voice Terms of Service are being notified of the upcoming changes, and have until May 14th, 2014 to remove the offending apps or transition users to a new system.

It sounds like they'll still allow third-party access, but possibly with more restrictions.
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SteveInWA
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« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2013, 06:39:31 pm »

Apparently Google is getting ready to play hardball with third-party GV devs: http://www.androidcentral.com/google-voice-won-t-be-integrated-latest-hangouts-update-it-s-coming

Quote
Going further, Google Voice is going to get notably more secure with changes to the ways third-party apps have access to the service. Developers who currently violate the Google Voice Terms of Service are being notified of the upcoming changes, and have until May 14th, 2014 to remove the offending apps or transition users to a new system.

It sounds like they'll still allow third-party access, but possibly with more restrictions.
I wouldn't make that assumption.  Read Obihai's blog post today.  The message is:  direct GV support on OBi devices is going away.  There are plenty of inexpensive alternatives.
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FreeServiceForLife
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« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2013, 04:59:49 pm »


I wouldn't make that assumption.  Read Obihai's blog post today.  The message is:  direct GV support on OBi devices is going away.  There are plenty of inexpensive alternatives.

[/quote]

http://blog.obihai.com/

 Angry Wow this really sucks.. I thought for sure that this was going to be a good thing as Google Hangouts does not require a gmail account to make calls.  I set up my Google Voice with a different domain email address and was able to join Google Hangouts and make calls with this non-gmail address.  I thought this fact would really open up the service rather than limit it.  Oh well looks like Google Hangouts app will be my new best friend!   Roll Eyes
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Crow550
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« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2013, 08:02:52 pm »

I hope something changes and something good comes from this as otherwise this will pretty much kill Obihai.... Maybe a partnership with Google? Or Google buy them?

I'm sure Google knows that people use G-Voice as a landline replacement and has something up there sleeves. They have until May to announce something as they know people will be raging over this feature going away....

Sadly only a smaller niche group will still use these Obi boxes with other services.... As the only reason why anyone even knows Obihai even exists was because they offered a way to turn G-Voice into a Landline replacement....

It's still too early to tell what will happen.... The blog can always be updated....
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Lavarock7
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« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2013, 08:52:32 am »

I hope something changes and something good comes from this as otherwise this will pretty much kill Obihai....

I disagree with that statement. If that was the case, Vonage, Packet8, Ooma and BasicTalk would not be as popular as they are.

Most other hardware is tied directly to one provider and has to be hacked to open it up.

I think that once the dust settles, the Obi forums will be a bit quieter without the added complexity of GV.

Sure I'll miss GV on the Obi but someone will find a way to keep it working.
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Crow550
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« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2013, 09:48:14 am »

BasicTalk uses Vonages network.

Well see how things go. Still a long ways till May and things can change by then.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 09:49:57 am by Crow550 » Logged
carl
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« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2013, 01:52:36 pm »

I hope something changes and something good comes from this as otherwise this will pretty much kill Obihai....

I disagree with that statement. If that was the case, Vonage, Packet8, Ooma and BasicTalk would not be as popular as they are.

Most other hardware is tied directly to one provider and has to be hacked to open it up.

I think that once the dust settles, the Obi forums will be a bit quieter without the added complexity of GV.

Sure I'll miss GV on the Obi but someone will find a way to keep it working.

Actually, it could cause Obihai a lot of problems. They marketed the device almost exclusively as a Google Voice adapter. They did very little to make the device usable for non tech folks who would like to use SIP providers, and they ignored all requests to do just that. The return departments at amazon, newegg and elsewhere will be running overtime. And it's all totally unnecessary and all of obihai's own making.
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gderf
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« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2013, 02:18:58 pm »

They marketed the device almost exclusively as a Google Voice adapter. They did very little to make the device usable for non tech folks who would like to use SIP providers, and they ignored all requests to do just that. The return departments at amazon, newegg and elsewhere will be running overtime. And it's all totally unnecessary and all of obihai's own making.

I disagree with this statement  Smiley

I used the OBiTALK interface to configure my OBi200 for Google Voice. Google Voice was but one choice in a list of sixteen VoIP providers. Setting up my second SP with CallWithUs was equally trivial when I selected it from the same list. As was it to configure my third SP for the free DID I got from CallCentric.

Amazon's return policy is 30 days. I don't know about the others. I got mine from Amazon last week so I am within the return period. But I'm keeping it anyway.

But anybody who continues to sell OBis and hypes Google Voice needs to explicitly state that GV support is ending May 15, 2014. Either that or offer refunds until June 15, 2014 regardless when it was purchased post October 31, 2013.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 02:23:32 pm by gderf » Logged

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SteveInWA
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« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2013, 06:41:04 pm »

I'm sure Google knows that people use G-Voice as a landline replacement and has something up there sleeves. They have until May to announce something as they know people will be raging over this feature going away....

Google has no interest (and nothing to gain as a business) in being a land line VoIP provider.  That market is rapidly declining.  Approximately 90% of US households now have a mobile phone, and the percentage of people relying solely on POTS landlines is declining to around 10%.  The local broadband companies have the lion's share of the VoIP home phone business, thanks to aggressive sales tactics to bundle phone with TV and internet service.  "Pure play" VoIP providers like Vonage will be a declining niche market.  The hundreds of other SIP-based VoIP providers (e.g. Anveo, Callcentric, voip.ms, callwithus....) will continue to sell to their niche markets of techie users and small-to-midsize businesses.

Google's primary business focus now, with regard to communications, is to continue to grow the Google+ user base, and offer services within that ecosystem, especially on mobile devices.  The recent (and future-planned) enhancements to Hangouts are the stated direction for text, audio and video chatting.

Bottom line:  work through your "stages of grief" (the denial phase, the anger phase, the acceptance phase...), take the 6 months to select your alternative tools, and you'll be ready for the transition in May.
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Crow550
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« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2013, 07:18:20 pm »

If they have voip calling with Hangouts then why not offer it through ATA devices? What's the big loss?

Hell I don't mind using G-Voice through another VOIP provider as long as they add the ability of your G-Voice number being displayed on the caller id when you call out! This also applies to non-smart phones too.

I know someone who ported there Landline to G-Voice and uses it with an Obi and has calls forward on her non-smart prepaid phone.

The pain in the butt part is when she calls out on her Cell it displays the Cell number and not not her G-Voice number.

Which now she will need to shop around for another VOIP service at Home....

So as cool as G-Voice is it has some things it needs to fix badly.

A lot of people don't know that Skype offers a similar feature that works with a limited set of VOIP devices too.
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carl
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« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2013, 07:51:21 pm »


I disagree with this statement  Smiley

I used the OBiTALK interface to configure my OBi200 for Google Voice. Google Voice was but one choice in a list of sixteen VoIP providers. Setting up my second SP with CallWithUs was equally trivial when I selected it from the same list. As was it to configure my third SP for the free DID I got from CallCentric.


IF you stick to the list of 15 SIP providers and IF you do not have to make any changes like carrier mandated re routing or applying star codes to get certain features work then yes, you are fine- most of the time. You will be stuck with the basic configuration with no possibility to adapt to for example, other countries or your personal needs. And you will miss out on all the truly awesome features and possibilities Obi has.
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gderf
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« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2013, 08:09:37 pm »


IF you stick to the list of 15 SIP providers and IF you do not have to make any changes like carrier mandated re routing or applying star codes to get certain features work then yes, you are fine- most of the time. You will be stuck with the basic configuration with no possibility to adapt to for example, other countries or your personal needs. And you will miss out on all the truly awesome features and possibilities Obi has.

You seem to want to have it both ways without having to lift the hood and get your hands dirty.
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giqcass
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« Reply #14 on: November 05, 2013, 07:04:57 pm »

Incoming calls through Google Voice to the Obi will still work fine if you use another provider like Callcentric as a "Middle man".  You can use the following setup. http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=3640.msg24230#msg24230 

For legal reasons Google Voice MUST remain a "Phone Management Service" and NOT   any of the phone service provider types defined by the FCC.  If they meet the definition of a Land-line telephone service, a cell phone telephone service, or a VOIP telephone service they will be forced to charge monthly fees.

Phone service providers of certain types as defined by the FCC must provide some form of 911 in the US.  Similar laws exist in other countries as well.  That service can be very expensive and very complicated to put together.  In addition there are a lot of other regulations they would be forced to comply with.  All of these things collectively raise costs.  Ooma is a good example of this.  They were a free service until the 911 laws were put in place for VOIP providers.

Google is sending letters to developers of Android applications that make direct connections rather then initiating a connection using the phones incoming phone number like the official app does. Google is trying to protect itself from litigation by not allowing phones (and probably ATA's) to use it's service to bypass the phone service providers. 

Obi probably got one of the letters from Google saying they misused the service because of the way they connect to it.  Obi may have decided not to pursue direct calling through Google Voice for that reason.  If Obi rewrote the code so that calls were being terminated to a DID number instead of directly to the Obi device that could put them in compliance with Google's TOS.






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