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Author Topic: Google Sets the Date for the End of XMPP with Google Voice  (Read 1331286 times)
sdb-
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Posts: 151


« Reply #40 on: November 01, 2013, 07:33:02 am »

I suppose I am one of the very few people who use the phone barely any. I mean, it is usually less than maybe 5 minutes a month.
So, you can have CallWithus and it will cost you (gasp) 5 cents a month. And you can have free WA phone number from IPKall or free NY number from CallCentric. Or you can have both in and out from CallCentric or Voip.MS and it will cost you 10 cents a month.

Let's stop "the sky is falling" nonsense. Obihai is still an excellent device. It used to have a unique feature (GV support); now it will compete with Grandstreams and others. Maybe it will force them to improve their documentation - or maybe they will abandon retail market altogether!

The thing is that right now, with GV, I have a number that is local to me. I do not want to have to give out a WA number or NY number to people if I need to give them a number.

Read more carefully.

Get the free DID mentioned above.  Configure your OBi.  Forward your google voice number to the new DID.  Done.

Nobody but you needs to know.

Now your incoming calls to GV get forwarded to the DID and then to your OBi.  Free.  And nobody needs to know.

Outgoing calls go thru the new service.  Costs pennies a call.  Or for the ultimate cheapskates like me, add another service like localphone for outgoing calls.  $0.005/minute or various plans up to $5/month for 5000 minutes.  That is nearly as cheap as GV for low usage, and still much cheaper than the PSTN.

(Note that localphone bills by the minute while some other services charge $0.01/minute but bill in six-second increments which may be cheaper if you make a lot of short calls.  On average you will waste 1/2 of a billing increment per call.)
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AntonS
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Posts: 38


« Reply #41 on: November 01, 2013, 07:37:43 am »

People who think that Google will somehow let Obihai still use Google Voice are very likely mistaken. Google is not retiring Google Voice, but is limiting access to it. Only Google products like Hangouts will be be able to use it.  One can keep your Google Voice number your main number people call you, by provisioning your Obi's with a SIP provider. The cheapest seems to be Callcentric which will give you a free DID number in NY. You can make that number a forwarding number for your Google Voice number. You can also spoof your GV number as an out going call number for free:
See:http://www.callcentric.com/features/external_caller_id
If I understand the procedures correctly you might want to do this first, so that you can use your OBI to verify your GV number with Callcentric.
Another feature seems to be that you can configure on Callcentric for free a second OBI as a sub account. This would eliminate the song and and dance one has to go through to have two OBI's on one GV account.
Does anyone have experience with the call quality of Callcentric vs say Google Voice, or other SIP providers.
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carl
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Posts: 453


« Reply #42 on: November 01, 2013, 08:03:54 am »

I mentioned it before. Localphone. US DID 99c/month, 0.5c/min to lower 48.

Yeah, I saw that, but their rates page kind of confuses me. I am looking at the United States 250 page, specifically. It says "This service requires you to dial a local landline number, that means you may also pay your phone provider local charges." Does that mean you have to call another number before you can call the number you want to call? Or what exactly does this mean? I do like the half a cent per minute, or in the case of the 250, 1/3 of a cent per minute and $0.75 per month access.

I guess I am just very new to all this lingo for this sort of thing. I am just guessing on a lot of terms like DID (I guess Direct Incoming Dial??). I suppose if I spent a lot of time researching this I might be able to figure out more about it, but right now it is all confusing the hell out of me. I don't want a lot of jargon or extra information. I just want a simple, straight forward, idiot proof explanation of fees and benefits from these services and I am not really finding it. I am needing clear info like that because I am going to have to explain and justify this stuff with my wife before I can do anything. She kinda likes to know what's going on with this stuff, too.

Localphone provides a number of different services.
Like : 1. VOIP calling for which you can use your Obi device. Their outgoing rates apply to that ( 0.5 c us lower 48)
2. DID service- free incoming calling
3. Local numbers- you chose a localo number in lieu of a long distance/foreign number and call those numbers to reach your friends. Outgoing rtates apply
4. Calling card services. You have a virtual calling card( which you can also use fromj your cell p0hone0 and call arounfd the world for their outgoing rates
5. Callback service You call  an acess number, hang up, the system calls you back and you dial the destibation number.

All the services can be subscribed together or separately each as you wish.
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carl
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Posts: 453


« Reply #43 on: November 01, 2013, 08:08:03 am »

https://plus.google.com/106636280351174936240/posts/MjyncJEbzxK
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azrobert
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Posts: 4019


« Reply #44 on: November 01, 2013, 08:24:04 am »

Inbound GV calls using a free DID was covered several times in this thread, but I didn't see free outbound calls using GV.  You can initiate a call from a PC when signed on to GV. GV will call your DID and after you answer, GV will complete the outbound call. I know this is a pain, but for those that want FREE this is a solution.
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carl
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Posts: 453


« Reply #45 on: November 01, 2013, 09:26:08 am »

Inbound GV calls using a free DID was covered several times in this thread, but I didn't see free outbound calls using GV.  You can initiate a call from a PC when signed on to GV. GV will call your DID and after you answer, GV will complete the outbound call. I know this is a pain, but for those that want FREE this is a solution.
Apparently, there is a way to do it through Sipsorcery, but I do not know the details.
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gderf
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Posts: 489



« Reply #46 on: November 01, 2013, 09:32:42 am »

You can initiate a call from a PC when signed on to GV. GV will call your DID and after you answer, GV will complete the outbound call. I know this is a pain, but for those that want FREE this is a solution.

Yes, this works. But will it continue to work after Google disables XMPP in May 2014?
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azrobert
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« Reply #47 on: November 01, 2013, 09:51:18 am »

Apparently, there is a way to do it through Sipsorcery, but I do not know the details.

You have to setup a provider with your GV credentials and a callback number. Then add some code in your Dialplan to use the provider. It's relatively easy and there many examples on their forum.

The problem with SipSorcery is it's not free and costs $69 per year. It was free, but not anymore.

Will Google cut off this type of access too?
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azrobert
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« Reply #48 on: November 01, 2013, 10:07:12 am »

You can initiate a call from a PC when signed on to GV. GV will call your DID and after you answer, GV will complete the outbound call. I know this is a pain, but for those that want FREE this is a solution.

Yes, this works. But will it continue to work after Google disables XMPP in May 2014?

This is how GV was originally designed to work and doesn't use XMPP. It was intended to work with a PSTN phone and the callback function, but you can use a SIP provider and a DID. I doubt this will change.

People with a PSTN line can call their GV number, get a prompt and then make a free long distance call. This probably will not change either.
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carl
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Posts: 453


« Reply #49 on: November 01, 2013, 10:19:30 am »

http://tech.iprock.com/?p=9784
For asterisk/freepbx users the old way

No, Sipsorcery makes no sense to me for $ 69.-.  That's 13800 minutes with Localphone.  I use far less than that.
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carl
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Posts: 453


« Reply #50 on: November 01, 2013, 10:27:06 am »

I agree that this will kill OBi's retail business.  I suspect they thought Google would start charging a small amount for the service versus dropping it.



It depends how they handle it. Right now, they cater largely to the GV folks and leave SIP providers for the hobbyist minority.  If they make a 90 degree turn quickly, it could remain a retail success.

From my brief chat with them it seems that they are absolutely out from Google business and that they will not bother with hangouts, thus the May 14th is th last day indeed.
I will wait till February with any move.

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gderf
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Posts: 489



« Reply #51 on: November 01, 2013, 10:46:34 am »



This is how GV was originally designed to work and doesn't use XMPP. It was intended to work with a PSTN phone and the callback function, but you can use a SIP provider and a DID. I doubt this will change.

People with a PSTN line can call their GV number, get a prompt and then make a free long distance call. This probably will not change either.



Thanks for the explanation. I have today obtained a free DID from CallCentric and verified this works as described. If this and the free outbound calling via Google continues to work post May 15, 2014, I can live with the workaround.
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DaveHuss
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Posts: 1


« Reply #52 on: November 01, 2013, 11:15:47 am »

As someone pointed out the "call google, enter the number you wish to call, and have google call you back" method of placing a call should hopefully still work. If that is the case then a call-centric/pay by the minute number is all you will need. To make dial your GV number less painful, program it as one of the speed dials. I haven't looked in the ObiHai's manual or done this yet (will when I get home) but you should be able to set a speed dial by picking up the phone and hitting:

*74 following by 1+your google voice number + 2-9 (to set which speed dial it'll be). Then to call your GV number just hit 2-9 (whichever you chose) followed by the # key.

To check a speed dial number you can hit *75 + 2-9.

So theoretically to place a call all you'd have to do is his 2# + dial the number you want, hang up, have google call you back and it'll only cost you a minute (a penny basically) no matter how long the phone call is (I assume <1 min calls are rounded up, if not it'll be even cheaper).
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steveken
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Posts: 10


« Reply #53 on: November 01, 2013, 11:56:25 am »

Read more carefully.

Get the free DID mentioned above.  Configure your OBi.  Forward your google voice number to the new DID.  Done.

Nobody but you needs to know.

Now your incoming calls to GV get forwarded to the DID and then to your OBi.  Free.  And nobody needs to know.

Outgoing calls go thru the new service.  Costs pennies a call.  Or for the ultimate cheapskates like me, add another service like localphone for outgoing calls.  $0.005/minute or various plans up to $5/month for 5000 minutes.  That is nearly as cheap as GV for low usage, and still much cheaper than the PSTN.

Ok, so, basically, I just set up a "Free Phone Number" on the CallCentric site, follow the setup procedures for the Obi100 on the page http://www.callcentric.com/support/device/obihai/obi100, then go into the Google Voice settings and set up a new forward to number with the CallCentric number on it? Seems easy enough.

The only drawback is that since that would be a free incoming call only option, I would have to figure out something if someone wanted to use the phones for outgoing calls. That is where all the spoofing comes into play, I take it. Because if I set it up that way, I couldn't just pick up the phone and do the whole Google calling you back routine like DaveHuss just mentioned because I wouldn't have a way to call out to the Google Voice number to get it to do all the calling back.

Oh, well, I guess one could use the Hangouts app to do the outbound initiating call and then have it ring the CallCentric number configured in the Obi100. Is that right? Or would you not be able to do something like that with the Hangouts app because it is already the Google Voice number and would just be initiating the call from there? I guess I am still a tad confused on this part of the plan. Would that only work from within the Voice webpage on a computer?
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carl
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Posts: 453


« Reply #54 on: November 01, 2013, 12:04:23 pm »


The only drawback is that since that would be a free incoming call only option, I would have to figure out something if someone wanted to use the phones for outgoing calls. That is where all the spoofing comes into play, I take it. Because if I set it up that way, I couldn't just pick up the phone and do the whole Google calling you back routine like DaveHuss just mentioned because I wouldn't have a way to call out to the Google Voice number to get it to do all the calling back.



That's why you set up Localhone as a second provider next to callcentric on your Obi, and register all your numbers you have with them. You then set your desired number as Caller ID for your outgoing calls. You will pay the 0.5c/min. This way you ootbound calling will remain fully functional regardless whether you computer is on. off course, you can call out with Callcentric directly however that would be almost 2c/min.
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Ostracus
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Posts: 576


« Reply #55 on: November 01, 2013, 12:53:44 pm »

I suppose I am one of the very few people who use the phone barely any. I mean, it is usually less than maybe 5 minutes a month.
So, you can have CallWithus and it will cost you (gasp) 5 cents a month. And you can have free WA phone number from IPKall or free NY number from CallCentric. Or you can have both in and out from CallCentric or Voip.MS and it will cost you 10 cents a month.

Let's stop "the sky is falling" nonsense. Obihai is still an excellent device. It used to have a unique feature (GV support); now it will compete with Grandstreams and others. Maybe it will force them to improve their documentation - or maybe they will abandon retail market altogether!

Don't know about sky, but with their upcoming devices it looked like Obihai was aiming for the business market, in which I doubt GV is a big player.
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azrobert
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Posts: 4019


« Reply #56 on: November 01, 2013, 02:43:55 pm »

As someone pointed out the "call google, enter the number you wish to call, and have google call you back" method of placing a call should hopefully still work. If that is the case then a call-centric/pay by the minute number is all you will need.

I don't think you understand how GV works.
There are 2 methods to make a call from a PSTN or your OBi.

Method 1: Sign in to GV and initiate a call. GV does a callback.

Method 2: Call your GV number. You get a GV prompt. You enter "2" and the outbound number. GV makes the call. No callback.

I have a PSTN line and can call my GV number for free and then make a free long distance call. If you only have a SIP provider and using method 2, you are getting charged for the call by your provider.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 02:46:22 pm by azrobert » Logged
gderf
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Posts: 489



« Reply #57 on: November 01, 2013, 03:27:50 pm »



Method 2: Call your GV number. You get a GV prompt. You enter "2" and the outbound number. GV makes the call. No callback.

I have a PSTN line and can call my GV number for free and then make a free long distance call. If you only have a SIP provider and using method 2, you are getting charged for the call by your provider.


OK, so when using method 2 with a SIP provider I would estimate it takes less than a minute for GV to pick up the call and make the outbound call. Is the time charged for by the SIP provider over at that point - ie a one minute call?
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Help me OBiHai PhoneOBi. You’re my only hope.
carl
Sr. Member
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Posts: 453


« Reply #58 on: November 01, 2013, 03:48:41 pm »



OK, so when using method 2 with a SIP provider I would estimate it takes less than a minute for GV to pick up the call and make the outbound call. Is the time charged for by the SIP provider over at that point - ie a one minute call?
No. You will be charged for the entire duration of the call. The 'method' 2 makes, as azrobert said, only sense if you have a PSTN line with free local but no long distance calling.
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dennist
Jr. Member
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Posts: 35


« Reply #59 on: November 03, 2013, 03:31:02 pm »

I suppose I am one of the very few people who use the phone barely any. I mean, it is usually less than maybe 5 minutes a month.
So, you can have CallWithus and it will cost you (gasp) 5 cents a month. And you can have free WA phone number from IPKall or free NY number from CallCentric. Or you can have both in and out from CallCentric or Voip.MS and it will cost you 10 cents a month.

Let's stop "the sky is falling" nonsense. Obihai is still an excellent device. It used to have a unique feature (GV support); now it will compete with Grandstreams and others. Maybe it will force them to improve their documentation - or maybe they will abandon retail market altogether!

The thing is that right now, with GV, I have a number that is local to me. I do not want to have to give out a WA number or NY number to people if I need to give them a number.

Read more carefully.

Get the free DID mentioned above.  Configure your OBi.  Forward your google voice number to the new DID.  Done.

Nobody but you needs to know.

Now your incoming calls to GV get forwarded to the DID and then to your OBi.  Free.  And nobody needs to know.

Outgoing calls go thru the new service.  Costs pennies a call.  Or for the ultimate cheapskates like me, add another service like localphone for outgoing calls.  $0.005/minute or various plans up to $5/month for 5000 minutes.  That is nearly as cheap as GV for low usage, and still much cheaper than the PSTN.

(Note that localphone bills by the minute while some other services charge $0.01/minute but bill in six-second increments which may be cheaper if you make a lot of short calls.  On average you will waste 1/2 of a billing increment per call.)

I am not familiar with using OBi with other VOIP services. Can you point me to the right direction?

Where can I find the free DID?

I have an OBi 110. SP1 is configured with Google Voice. Should I configure the incoming DID in SP2?

For the outgoing calls, like Localphone, where should I do the configuration? SP1 or SP2? I could not find the instruction of setting up Obi device in Localphone’s website.
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