GrooVe IP shutting down due to Google Voice changes
http://androidcommunity.com/groove-ip-shutting-down-due-to-google-voice-changes-20131104/
Happy Halloween: Google Puts the Final Nail in the Google Voice Coffin
http://nerdvittles.com/?p=7940&cpage=1#comment-93885
Direct communication between Google Voice (GV) and your OBi will stop working in both directions when Google disables XMPP as stated on May 15, 2014.
But this does not mean that you can no longer use your OBi with Google Voice.
If you forward calls from GV to another phone number that is provisioned on your OBi, incoming phone service will continue. You can get such a number for free from CallCentric. See: http://www.callcentric.com/dids/free_phone_number
To continue making free outbound calls from your OBi using Google Voice you can use GV's click to dial with callback from a web browser.
The above descriptions of how continued service can work depends on Google and OBihai not disabling other things that would prevent such usage.
There is a lot of discussion about this on the forum, look around some to find it.
Let me also suggest that you get your news and information about Google Voice/Talk/Chat/Hangouts from the official Google Product Forums (GPF), instead of from a highly-opinionated (and at this point, ranting) blogger (Ward Mundy). He's attempting to twist Google's business and technical direction into some sort of devious and dishonest scheme. "The lady doth protest too much, methinks."
The "Android Community" blog was also inaccurate: "This all centers around Google's move away from XMPP, the protocol apps like GrooVe IP were using to latch onto Voice. When Google went from Talk to Hangouts, they transitioned away from XMPP, making things like voice and video chat proprietary. Google is now bringing that energy to Voice, opting to shut down operability with no alternative in sight."
The "alternative in sight" is already here: Hangouts. Hangouts can be a forwarding VoIP phone destination for GV calls. Hangouts can dial telephone calls. Google Voice never inter-operated with XMPP. Google Chat did, and Chat is being replaced by Hangouts, which will migrate to communications via WebRTC and HTML5. Focusing on WebRTC allows the browser to take over functions that formerly required a plugin. That plugin is a messy kludge, and every time it gets updated, it manages to break people's calling from Gmail. The latest plugin update broke calling for a lot of Mac users, for example.
The main point of confusion, is that Google Voice is not, and never was, a free phone service. It's an inbound call management system. Google's companion products, Talk, Chat, and now Hangouts, provide the VoIP functions. Yes, the names are confusing, but the important fact is that Google Voice isn't being shut down. Over time, we expect that most of the GV functions will be better-unified with Hangouts (both on the desktop web browser and the mobile interfaces). The GV team is working on this, but getting it right, without breaking the complex GV infrastructure, or pissing off the millions (yes millions) of GV users, is the top priority.
These blog articles are not helping people understand their options. As gderf points out, you can still use Google Voice with your OBi; just not with the Chat pseudo-phone via XMPP, that OBi and GrooVe IP have been using. And, as he pointed out, there are several other threads where you can read about these options. Enjoy using GV with your OBi!
^ This is a pretty good explanation. IMO.
I love Ward Mundy's articles but I thought he took this one a little too personally. It's better to look at this change as a new challenge and perhaps a new opportunity. Many people are doing the work needed to support Google Voice after XMPP.
Quote from: SteveInWA on November 12, 2013, 06:20:47 PM
The main point of confusion, is that Google Voice is not, and never was, a free phone service. It's an inbound call management system. Google's companion products, Talk, Chat, and now Hangouts, provide the VoIP functions.
As even Google Voice allows free outbound calls within the US using a traditional phone line (just in a roundabout manner), it's actually also an
outbound call management system. Calls can be initiated through the GV web site, or by dialing your own GV number and then continuing the call from there. However, as you indicated, the VoIP/XMPP interface that is being used for outbound calling by the OBi is actually part of Talk/Chat/Hangouts.
Actually, clicking the red CALL button on your GV web page gets broken when Hangouts is enabled (which in turn, disables old Chat), and so calling via one's GV page isn't supported at the moment. The "call your own GV number, then access your VM in admin mode and then press 2 to make a new call" method does continue to work, of course.
Again, bottom line is that this is now a somewhat messy work in progress, and I expect more confusion to continue until the products are integrated.
So don't enable Hangouts.
Quote from: gderf on November 13, 2013, 07:23:38 PM
So don't enable Hangouts.
Well, yes, for the time being. What Google now calls "Old Chat" will be going away soon, so I didn't want to give the impression that it's a long-term workaround.
I have the GV plugin installed in Chrome which allows me to dial by clicking on phone numbers or by selecting numbers from my contact lists by typing letters in the names. Will that no longer work when Old Chat goes away?
I don't know the details of how the various (not-well-integrated) features and functions will work or not work over time (and if I did, sadly, I couldn't disclose them). The GV extension's current function depends on the voice and video (aka Chat/Hangouts) plugin. I assume the extension will migrate to WebRTC support.
In general, I expect that the functions that are supported today via the browser plugin will either continue to work via direct browser-based (WebRTC/HTML5) support, or they will be replaced by similar web apps under the Hangouts umbrella. Eventually, the need for the plugin will go away, but not before the equivalent, native support is provided via the browsers.
In the immediate future, if your preferred method of calling is via the GV extension, enjoy using it as long as it works. If you'd like to try the Hangouts browser extension, that is another way to place calls via the browser, and it also supports video calling between Hangouts users.
Quote from: gderf on November 13, 2013, 08:27:07 PM
I have the GV plugin installed in Chrome which allows me to dial by clicking on phone numbers or by selecting numbers from my contact lists by typing letters in the names. Will that no longer work when Old Chat goes away?
Google has been pushing HTML5 / web RTC. Because Chrome is a Google product it supports those as well. Some of the other browsers may need plugins to function. Interfaces may look a little different but it will at least work.
Quote from: SteveInWA on November 13, 2013, 08:40:53 PM
In the immediate future, if your preferred method of calling is via the GV extension, enjoy using it as long as it works.
The GV extension not my preferred way of making calls today. I have used and configured it to the point that I know it works to make callback initiated calls which would be one way to continue on with GV and OBi post May 15, 2014, assuming is isn't broken by Google in the future.
Quote from: gderf on November 14, 2013, 06:10:38 AM
Quote from: SteveInWA on November 13, 2013, 08:40:53 PM
In the immediate future, if your preferred method of calling is via the GV extension, enjoy using it as long as it works.
The GV extension not my preferred way of making calls today. I have used and configured it to the point that I know it works to make callback initiated calls which would be one way to continue on with GV and OBi post May 15, 2014, assuming is isn't broken by Google in the future.
Which of the various, poorly-integrated features and tools will, or will not work after May 15th, is just speculation at this time. My point was, you asked if the extension will work. I said it works now, and I speculated that Google will supply some sort of WebRTC-based replacement for it after that date. My assumption is that, over time (many months, slowly), features will migrate toward a better-integrated overall platform, and that platform will be Hangouts. Not the half-assed Hangouts of today, November 15, 2013, but an improved and evolving Hangouts.
My comments, speculations and assumptions are based on my experience with the offering, both as a user and as someone who supports users over on the Google Voice product forum, and some information that I can share without violating the NDA I have signed with Google.
As long as there is a free home phone line available I would continue using GV just as before by "dialing" from the web browser. My wife also works at home a few days a week so just the home phone line isn't enough. In my case, I have to have a desk phone for my home office so ended up starting a VOIP account with VOIPO. This fulfills my phone needs and actually gives me more features than GV ever did. Yes it costs me a few dollars / month but it's $6.21/month for the first two years (paid in advance) and then goes to approximately $15/month after that. I can afford that. I've learned my lesson. I'm not depending on free services any more. I have specific teleworking requirements for my convenience. I'm willing to pay for those if necessary.
Thanks in advance for any advice. I use Obi with GV, but the GV # is forwarded to my free callcentric number for e911. I understand from this thread that in May when the changes occur, I will still be able to receive calls like I do now. But, what about outgoing calls? Right now I use GV for that. Any ideas on alternatives where I can still have my GV number show as the caller ID when I place an outgoing call? I assume I may have to use something like Callcentric to place the outgoing call after May if GV will not be able to place it directly from my Obi202.
Quote from: telecomm on December 10, 2013, 01:46:00 PMAny ideas on alternatives where I can still have my GV number show as the caller ID when I place an outgoing call?
You could set up a FreePBX based system using something like Asterisk for Raspberry Pi (http://www.raspberry-asterisk.org/) and use it as a Service Provider for your Obi, and then see if the old method of placing outgoing Google Voice calls (http://tech.iprock.com/?p=9784) from the pre-xmpp days will still work. I think it does now, but there's no way of knowing if it will continue to work indefinitely.
Your incoming calls forwarded to your free Callcentric DID number will continue to work post May 15, 2014, so long as that is a working solution as it is now for you. Some of those free Callcentric NYC area DIDs are having problems now, so there is no telling if those that are working will continue to do so. You can get a free IPKall DID today to play with now if you want to have a backup. Just aim it at your Callcentric SIP credentials.
For outgoing calls post May 15, 2014 you can buy outgoing VoIP service from any number of vendors. They should all allow you to use your GV number for CallerID. I have PAYG outgoing service with CallWithUS. I gave them $5.00 for about 475 outgoing minutes which do not expire. I have only used a few of those minutes to place test calls.
A lot of people will be moving to localphone for outgoing calls. They start at 1/2 cent per minute pay as you go or 1/10 of a cent per minute if you buy a bucket of minutes each month and they will "spoof" your caller ID so it appears the call came from your Google Voice account. Any service with caller ID "spoofing" will work.
The old Asterisk method will work as well but when Google changes something it can break in which case you must wait for an update. It has worked pretty well for a long time but you never know.
Quote from: giqcass on December 10, 2013, 03:28:36 PM
A lot of people will be moving to localphone for outgoing calls. They start at 1/2 cent per minute pay as you go or 1/10 of a cent per minute if you buy a bucket of minutes each month and they will "spoof" your caller ID so it appears the call came from your Google Voice account. Any service with caller ID "spoofing" will work.
The old Asterisk method will work as well but when Google changes something it can break in which case you must wait for an update. It has worked pretty well for a long time but you never know.
I would not call it spoofing. You can set any registered number( which has to be verified) as your caller ID, it cannot be just any number. So I can pick any of my Localphone DID's, my 2 GV numbers , My Callcentric number or my 2 cell phone numbers. That's it.
Voip.ms allows spoofing CID to shock your friends, as in WH, NSA & CIA. Just do not pretend to be them in the call or they will come after you.
:-*
Quote from: carl on December 10, 2013, 07:13:31 PM
I would not call it spoofing. You can set any registered number( which has to be verified) as your caller ID, it cannot be just any number. So I can pick any of my Localphone DID's, my 2 GV numbers , My Callcentric number or my 2 cell phone numbers. That's it.
Call it whatever you want. Each provider calls it something different. Spoofing is a generally accepted term. Despite having a negative connotation it accurately describes what localphone is doing. When a service sends caller ID for a number of which it is not the authoritative register the service is spoofing the caller ID. So if localphone sends your Google Voice number it is spoofing it.
It is not "spoofing" unless you are sending a caller id that does not reach back to you.
There is no direct tie or association between a CID which is an identifier for an incoming trunk, and an outgoing trunk. That association has to be created by someone. If you go to the phone company as a home or small business owner and rent a phone line, the phone company forms the association. If your business grows and you need more incoming lines than outgoing (or the opposite) then the phone company no longer knows how you will be associating your lines, and so will have you designate the CID(s) to be used for your outgoing line(s).
Likewise a VOIP provider needs you to make that CID designation because they don't know how your lines are configured. Therefore when you set your CID on an outgoing trunk it is not spoofing, but is merely creating the association which people expect to exist, but which does not naturally exist.
Quote from: giqcass on December 10, 2013, 03:28:36 PM
A lot of people will be moving to localphone for outgoing calls. They start at 1/2 cent per minute pay as you go or 1/10 of a cent per minute if you buy a bucket of minutes each month and they will "spoof" your caller ID so it appears the call came from your Google Voice account. Any service with caller ID "spoofing" will work.
The old Asterisk method will work as well but when Google changes something it can break in which case you must wait for an update. It has worked pretty well for a long time but you never know.
Thanks, I got a free DID from IPKall today. I tested it and my results are not that good. Sometimes the call comes through, other times it does not. I have the free IPKall and the free Callcentric DIDs setup so my GV number rings them via my Callcentric SIP, but still they only work part of the time. I have tested seperatly, without GV (direct DID), and still the same unreliability. Good thing about GV is at least the VM will go on and ask the caller to leave a message for those calls that never ring for me.
I wonder if going through Callcentric direct would provide more reliability? To pay for a plan to include incoming and outgoing calls on a non free DID line.
I have this setup for my wife with her business. She does not seem to think she is losing calls and all go to GV voice mail, but I wonder. Her internet is via ATT UVerse, if that even matters, and mine is WOW. I will have to go to her office and test, and if I find the same thing, switch to a more reliable method and just pay the 20 bucks or so a month. Of course, I welcome all ideas.
Quote from: telecomm on December 11, 2013, 11:56:46 AM
Thanks, I got a free DID from IPKall today. I tested it and my results are not that good. Sometimes the call comes through, other times it does not. I have the free IPKall and the free Callcentric DIDs setup so my GV number rings them via my Callcentric SIP, but still they only work part of the time. I have tested seperatly, without GV (direct DID), and still the same unreliability. Good thing about GV is at least the VM will go on and ask the caller to leave a message for those calls that never ring for me.
I wonder if going through Callcentric direct would provide more reliability? To pay for a plan to include incoming and outgoing calls on a non free DID line.
I have this setup for my wife with her business. She does not seem to think she is losing calls and all go to GV voice mail, but I wonder. Her internet is via ATT UVerse, if that even matters, and mine is WOW. I will have to go to her office and test, and if I find the same thing, switch to a more reliable method and just pay the 20 bucks or so a month. Of course, I welcome all ideas.
As of today, I would not recommend using either IPKall or Callcentric's free DID numbers as Google Voice forwarding destinations. Google's carrier is experiencing problems connecting to these numbers, resulting in various symptoms, including incorrect or missing caller ID data, delays in connecting, or failure to connect. I've escalated this issue to Google, but I am not optimistic it will be fixed in the near term. Some Anveo users are experiencing the same problem. From what we've seen so far, Callcentric's
paid DIDs, (in other words, DIDs you select in your area code of choice, and pay a monthly fee to maintain) work fine as forwarding targets for GV. Speculation (and only speculation at this time) is that the cause is the least-cost routing being used by GV's CLEC (carrier) to connect to the CLECs providing the free DIDs. Because this routing can be different from one call to the next, some users' free DIDs seem to work sometimes, and sometimes not, and some users' DIDs always or never work.
My own opinion as of today is that it is a waste of time to experiment further with swapping free DIDs until the CLECs resolve the issues.
I have not personally had any issues with an IpKall number. My thought here is if you aren't having trouble then just leave everything alone. I would also try to keep things as simple as possible. For reliability I have been forwarding my IpKall number directly to my Obi. I wish Google would allow us to forward directly to a sip address. That would remove a lot of issues. If you are willing to port your number Anveo and Callcentric provide most Google Voice call routing capabilities for a small price. They even have a few extra services. Localphone in my opinion remains an excellent choice for outbound calling but it offers no bells or whistles for inbound routing. That is why I choose to use them as an outbound only service.
Quote from: SteveInWA on December 11, 2013, 08:33:14 PM
Quote from: telecomm on December 11, 2013, 11:56:46 AM
Thanks, I got a free DID from IPKall today. I tested it and my results are not that good. Sometimes the call comes through, other times it does not. I have the free IPKall and the free Callcentric DIDs setup so my GV number rings them via my Callcentric SIP, but still they only work part of the time. I have tested seperatly, without GV (direct DID), and still the same unreliability. Good thing about GV is at least the VM will go on and ask the caller to leave a message for those calls that never ring for me.
I wonder if going through Callcentric direct would provide more reliability? To pay for a plan to include incoming and outgoing calls on a non free DID line.
I have this setup for my wife with her business. She does not seem to think she is losing calls and all go to GV voice mail, but I wonder. Her internet is via ATT UVerse, if that even matters, and mine is WOW. I will have to go to her office and test, and if I find the same thing, switch to a more reliable method and just pay the 20 bucks or so a month. Of course, I welcome all ideas.
As of today, I would not recommend using either IPKall or Callcentric's free DID numbers as Google Voice forwarding destinations. Google's carrier is experiencing problems connecting to these numbers, resulting in various symptoms, including incorrect or missing caller ID data, delays in connecting, or failure to connect. I've escalated this issue to Google, but I am not optimistic it will be fixed in the near term. Some Anveo users are experiencing the same problem. From what we've seen so far, Callcentric's paid DIDs, (in other words, DIDs you select in your area code of choice, and pay a monthly fee to maintain) work fine as forwarding targets for GV. Speculation (and only speculation at this time) is that the cause is the least-cost routing being used by GV's CLEC (carrier) to connect to the CLECs providing the free DIDs. Because this routing can be different from one call to the next, some users' free DIDs seem to work sometimes, and sometimes not, and some users' DIDs always or never work.
My own opinion as of today is that it is a waste of time to experiment further with swapping free DIDs until the CLECs resolve the issues.
Thanks! Any idea why paid DIDs might be working better? I think I will try that just in case, at least for the office phone.
Quote from: giqcass on December 11, 2013, 08:54:53 PM
I have not personally had any issues with an IpKall number. My thought here is if you aren't having trouble then just leave everything alone. I would also try to keep things as simple as possible. For reliability I have been forwarding my IpKall number directly to my Obi. I wish Google would allow us to forward directly to a sip address. That would remove a lot of issues. If you are willing to port your number Anveo and Callcentric provide most Google Voice call routing capabilities for a small price. They even have a few extra services. Localphone in my opinion remains an excellent choice for outbound calling but it offers no bells or whistles for inbound routing. That is why I choose to use them as an outbound only service.
Thanks. Would you mind pointing me in the right direction on how to direct forward the Ipkall # to the Obi?
Quote from: telecomm on December 12, 2013, 04:57:22 AM
Thanks! Any idea why paid DIDs might be working better? I think I will try that just in case, at least for the office phone.
I believe it is because the problem may exist in the choice of call routing between Google's local exchange carrier (CLEC), and Callcentric's CLEC, http://www.telengy.net that owns the blocks of DIDs CC is issuing for free. CC leases their paid DIDs from several other CLECs (depending on the location of the "rate center" or local calling exchange of the DID). It's always possible that those DIDs will suffer the same fate at some point, but there haven't been any reports of problems so far on CC's paid DIDs.
I'm going to go off-topic here, to say that, on the Google Voice Forum, we regularly try to discourage people from using GV for business purposes. There's no direct customer support from Google, and when things go wrong (like this, or worse, when your clients can't reach you), it can damage your business financially, and damage your reputation for responsiveness. Decide if the small amount of money saved is worth your risk.
Quote from: telecomm on December 12, 2013, 05:00:41 AM
Thanks. Would you mind pointing me in the right direction on how to direct forward the Ipkall # to the Obi?
See: https://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=1292.0
No idea if it works or not I have my IPKall number forwarded to my free Callcentric IP Freedom account which is registered on my OBi.
Quote from: SteveInWA on December 12, 2013, 05:33:55 AM
I'm going to go off-topic here, to say that, on the Google Voice Forum, we regularly try to discourage people from using GV for business purposes. There's no direct customer support from Google, and when things go wrong (like this, or worse, when your clients can't reach you), it can damage your business financially, and damage your reputation for responsiveness. Decide if the small amount of money saved is worth your risk.
FYIW in some areas it may not be even close to a small amount of money saved.
I have had the slow call resolution issue occur on both my Callcentric and Anveo services. I grabbed an IPKall number and that one has been reliable. Perhaps because the number i grabbed had been previously used as a forward for google voice. As when I tried to add that number to GV as a forward, I had to capture it from someone who had that number already setup on GV.
So right now I'm working with GV forwarding to IPKall which is hooked to Callcentric. sorry it is still not working for others. you can always go without the Caller Name and use the google chat hookup.
Quote from: giqcass on December 11, 2013, 08:54:53 PM
Localphone in my opinion remains an excellent choice for outbound calling but it offers no bells or whistles for inbound routing. That is why I choose to use them as an outbound only service.
Ther only real problem with incoming on Localphone is IMO the fact that you cannot retrieve your voice mail from any other phone than your own IP phone or via internet. Other than that, their DID's both national and international are excellent( land line quality on my overseas DID's) and for a small fraction of the price other providers charge.
Quote from: SteveInWA on December 12, 2013, 05:33:55 AM
I believe it is because the problem may exist in the choice of call routing between Google's local exchange carrier (CLEC), and Callcentric's CLEC, http://www.telengy.net that owns the blocks of DIDs CC is issuing for free. CC leases their paid DIDs from several other CLECs (depending on the location of the "rate center" or local calling exchange of the DID). It's always possible that those DIDs will suffer the same fate at some point, but there haven't been any reports of problems so far on CC's paid DIDs.
There has been a thread on DSL forum's voip chat to this matter, with excellent contributions and explanations from a senior IT guy from Callcentric posting under acronym Iscream. check it out.
I read that thread over on DSL reports. I wouldn't call it "excellent". IMO, there's more emotion than productive information. While I agree that Google needs to step up and work with their CLEC to diagnose and cooperatively solve the problem, the part that "Iscream" is indignantly ignoring is that they've either created their own little CLEC (Telengy) or they have some sort of business relationship with it. Think about it: there is no such thing as free beer. Why would they give away those DIDs? They're leveraging that CLEC to make some money on the inbound call interconnection fees, and it isn't exactly a world-class CLEC...free means cutting corners and using the cheapest possible routes. It's not surprising that Google's CLEC might be reacting to that by also using some low-grade/low-cost route to connect. Some of those routes have been known to not pass CID at all, or to mess it up, which is exactly what's happening. I am not an apologist for either side; I just don't feel the same sense of outrage as Iscream...their paid DIDs work just fine.
This is an interesting case study in the free-market and lightly-regulated consequences of deregulating the telephone network. We now have a "you get what you pay for" marketplace, instead of a monopoly, but some people still feel entitled to 1st class service at bargain-fare prices. Millions of people jumped all over MajicJack when it came out. MJ planned to make money on targeted advertising and interconnection fees. The former fizzled out (ahead of its time), and I dunno how much money they make on the latter. The result is that they raised prices and cut corners dramatically, like refusing to connect to many other carriers who charge higher interconnect fees (not to mention the world's worst customer support).
IMO, this GV<-->CLEC<-->CLEC<-->CC problem won't get resolved soon, because of the arm's-length way Google works with its CLEC, for legal/regulatory reasons. Google may or may not feel it's important to nag their CLEC to deal with what is really a very small percentage of their user base.
If anything this highlights the value that local telephone companies have provided. This morass that is the interconnecting of telephone signals is simply that, a morass. Google has almost if not completely zero motivation to do anything about it because whatever value they received from Grand Central purchase has nothing to do with all of use people using the voice service.
I wish they would fix the problem. But somehow I get the feeling that they just don't care.
@MikeHObi
I have the same setup and get CID but not Cnam (IpKall > 1777XXXXXXX@in.callcentric.com). Do you get Cnam inbound? If so how are you setup from IpKall?
Quote from: SteveInWA on December 12, 2013, 08:38:10 PM
They're leveraging that CLEC to make some money on the inbound call interconnection fees, and it isn't exactly a world-class CLEC...free means cutting corners and using the cheapest possible routes. It's not surprising that Google's CLEC might be reacting to that by also using some low-grade/low-cost route to connect. Some of those routes have been known to not pass CID at all, or to mess it up, which is exactly what's happening. I am not an apologist for either side;
It would need some good explanation what a terminating carrier like Telengy has to do with routing, incoming signalling and all of that.
Quote from: carl on December 14, 2013, 04:08:12 PM
Quote from: SteveInWA on December 12, 2013, 08:38:10 PM
They're leveraging that CLEC to make some money on the inbound call interconnection fees, and it isn't exactly a world-class CLEC...free means cutting corners and using the cheapest possible routes. It's not surprising that Google's CLEC might be reacting to that by also using some low-grade/low-cost route to connect. Some of those routes have been known to not pass CID at all, or to mess it up, which is exactly what's happening. I am not an apologist for either side;
It would need some good explanation what a terminating carrier like Telengy has to do with routing, incoming signalling and all of that.
Regardless of your desire for an explanation, the fact is, that calls routed from Google's CLEC to Telengy are either corrupting or losing caller ID or not being connected. Google and Callcentric are now aware of this fact, and they're trying to resolve it. Calls routed from Google's CLEC to other carriers (ILECs or CLECs) are working as expected, with a few periodic exceptions caused by LNP or inter-carrier routing errors.
Quote from: lhm. on December 13, 2013, 01:56:32 PM
@MikeHObi
I have the same setup and get CID but not Cnam (IpKall > 1777XXXXXXX@in.callcentric.com). Do you get Cnam inbound? If so how are you setup from IpKall?
As you may be aware, CID is (supposed to be) passed along with the call setup by the originating carrier. So, as long as it isn't broken (like it is with the GV-->Telengy situation at the moment), and as long as the originating caller hasn't blocked it, you'll get it at the terminating end. CNAM, on the other hand, is not transmitted with the call, but instead, is obtained via a database lookup by the terminating carrier during the ring period.
IPKall, being a free service like Google Voice, doesn't pay for CNAM -- it isn't doing the CNAM lookups. So, you won't get CNAM via IPKall. CC does do the lookups for its DIDs, even their free ones.
"IPKall, being a free service like Google Voice, doesn't pay for CNAM -- it isn't doing the CNAM lookups. So, you won't get CNAM via IPKall. CC does do the lookups for its DIDs, even their free ones."
It appears forwarded GV calls via IPKall to CC (free DID) via SIP will not show CNAM just CID. At least not for me.
Quote from: lhm. on December 15, 2013, 08:31:57 AM
"IPKall, being a free service like Google Voice, doesn't pay for CNAM -- it isn't doing the CNAM lookups. So, you won't get CNAM via IPKall. CC does do the lookups for its DIDs, even their free ones."
It appears forwarded GV calls via IPKall to CC (free DID) via SIP will not show CNAM just CID. At least not for me.
Yah, that is what I was (unsuccessfully) trying to say: when you terminate your GV call on a IPKall DID, and then send it along to Callcentric via a URI, IPKall, not CC, is the terminating PSTN carrier. Since IPKall isn't doing CNAM lookup, there is CNAM to send to CC via the SIP URI.
Quote from: lhm. on December 15, 2013, 08:31:57 AM
"IPKall, being a free service like Google Voice, doesn't pay for CNAM -- it isn't doing the CNAM lookups. So, you won't get CNAM via IPKall. CC does do the lookups for its DIDs, even their free ones."
It appears forwarded GV calls via IPKall to CC (free DID) via SIP will not show CNAM just CID. At least not for me.
I have accounts with Anveo and Callcentric. I have a small number of people who regularly call my voice line and the are setup in the address book for both Anveo and CallCentric. This with IPKall forwards into Callcentric, Callcentric looks up the CID in the address book and sends down the CNAME to the OBI. With Anveo, and probably Callcentric you can pay for them to look up the CNAME beyond their address books. But their address book lookup is no additional cost.
Just to make sure i am getting this right. Google voice to Obihai will stop working, but what will happen to the google voice number?
Are the functions of google voice going to stop working too?
The only thing that will change is the method that GV is used with OBi devices. Your GV number will not go away. You will still be able to forward it to another number such as Callcentric, VOIP.ms etc. that can be configured on OBi devices as a SIP account.
Quote from: N7AS on December 22, 2013, 09:14:51 PM
The only thing that will change is the method that GV is used with OBi devices. Your GV number will not go away. You will still be able to forward it to another number such as Callcentric, VOIP.ms etc. that can be configured on OBi devices as a SIP account.
I have two google voice numbers. One connected to obihai and the other goes to my cellphone (so it's just an alternate number I can give out). So you are saying that the second one that goes to my cellphone, that will work the same?
Yes, that is correct. Inbound calls via GoogleVoice is not the problem. It's outbound when they stop suportimg XMPP. Outbound calls can be routed through another provider such as Localphone, Callcentric, VOIP.ms or others.
Quote from: N7AS on December 22, 2013, 10:42:11 PM
Yes, that is correct. Inbound calls via GoogleVoice is not the problem. It's outbound when they stop suportimg XMPP. Outbound calls can be routed through another provider such as Localphone, Callcentric, VOIP.ms or others.
Sorry, just a little confused on what you said. the gv number that goes to my cellphone, that one will be alright, correct?
Now, the one that goes to obihai, are you saying that I will be able to get inbound calls still?
The GV number going direct to you OBi device will no longer work using XMPP. Your best bet would be with Localphone. A DID (phone number) is $0.99 per month. Inbound calls is free as well as outbound calls to toll free numbers. Outbound is $0.005 (1/2 cent) per min. They have subscriptions available.
For calls to US numbers.
250 min for $0.75 - $0.003 per min
800 min for $1.60 - $0.002 per min
5000 min for $5.00 - $0.001 per min
Everyone's needs are different.
My home setup includes an Ooma for the house phone. I set up a Google Voice number for this line that rings the home number and my wife's cell phone at the same time.
Then I have an Obi110 for my home office as a second line through Google Voice. Generally, when I am working from home, most of my time is spent on calls to an 877 number for work conferencing. I seldom receive an inbound call on my Obi.
I first I tried Callcentric's free plan thinking that the 877 number might have a VOIP SIP interface. Callcentric's online Obi110 instructions were not complete – I could not get my Obi device to register with them. However, this forum suggested some SIP changes and then it worked :-) Upon testing I found that I could call my VOIP at work office phone but not a 877 number. So, I cancelled the service.
I then tried Localphone, again picking their free option. Setup worked correctly and I can call my 877 number. When May rolls around I will forward my home office Google Voice number to the home phone number.
If you need to call 877 numbers, CallWithUs will terminate them for free. You don't even need an account with them to do this. There my be other providers who do this also.
Yea, looking at their site now. Seems to be aimed at a more knowledgeable person and there are not a lot of configuration examples. Also, not sure for USA only calling what the advantages are between standard, premuim and PSTN routes. Will spend some time looking at this in more detail.
Any info on voice quality and reliability with the service?
Quote from: noobcollege on December 22, 2013, 10:59:49 PM
Sorry, just a little confused on what you said. the gv number that goes to my cellphone, that one will be alright, correct?
Now, the one that goes to obihai, are you saying that I will be able to get inbound calls still?
Google is no longer going to support XMPP on their chat or voice service. If currently using nothing but Obi and Google voice, that means that calls placed to your GV number will no longer ring your devices connect to the Obi. This is because Obi uses XMPP through Google Chat to get calls into it. This change has no impact on the google voice client used on cell phones.
This also means that when you dial numbers through devices attached to your obi, they will not complete. This is because the Obi uses XMPP to communicate with google voice.
Since XMPP goes away, the obi can no longer talk to google.
As people have pointed out, many currently use various providers for low cost or free Direct Inward Dial numbers (DID) for incoming calls. They do this typically to get caller ID Name (and 911) which google does not provide. In these cases Google voice forwards to this 3rd part DID which then talks to the OBI via SIP. That will still work even if XMPP goes away because Google voice to the DID and the DID to the Obi are not using XMPP.
With the loss of XMPP the biggest decision for folks is are you are willing to loose some of the utility of the obi, and keep the free outgoing calls or keep the utility of the obi and pay for outgoing calls? If you like your GV number and you want the utility of the obi, then whatever service you pick for outgoing calls you will want a service than can spoof your CID so that your outgoing calls can show the GV number and not the number assigned to you by your outbound call service provider.
Quote from: MikeHObi on December 23, 2013, 07:29:44 AM
Quote from: noobcollege on December 22, 2013, 10:59:49 PM
Sorry, just a little confused on what you said. the gv number that goes to my cellphone, that one will be alright, correct?
Now, the one that goes to obihai, are you saying that I will be able to get inbound calls still?
Google is no longer going to support XMPP on their chat or voice service. If currently using nothing but Obi and Google voice, that means that calls placed to your GV number will no longer ring your devices connect to the Obi. This is because Obi uses XMPP through Google Chat to get calls into it. This change has no impact on the google voice client used on cell phones.
This also means that when you dial numbers through devices attached to your obi, they will not complete. This is because the Obi uses XMPP to communicate with google voice.
Since XMPP goes away, the obi can no longer talk to google.
As people have pointed out, many currently use various providers for low cost or free Direct Inward Dial numbers (DID) for incoming calls. They do this typically to get caller ID Name (and 911) which google does not provide. In these cases Google voice forwards to this 3rd part DID which then talks to the OBI via SIP. That will still work even if XMPP goes away because Google voice to the DID and the DID to the Obi are not using XMPP.
With the loss of XMPP the biggest decision for folks is are you are willing to loose some of the utility of the obi, and keep the free outgoing calls or keep the utility of the obi and pay for outgoing calls? If you like your GV number and you want the utility of the obi, then whatever service you pick for outgoing calls you will want a service than can spoof your CID so that your outgoing calls can show the GV number and not the number assigned to you by your outbound call service provider.
Thank you for clarifying. For the gv to obi device I just want free inbound calls, don't really need outbound. Do you have any suggestions on sites or set up?
You can get a free incoming only DID from Callcentric. Just forward your GV number to it and configure your OBi for Callcentric. There has been some trouble lately with calls not reaching some Callcentric DIDs. Maybe this will be finally solved by the time Google cuts of XMPP.
Or you can get a free IP Freedom account on Callcentric, configure your OBi to use it, and get a free DID from IPKall that you forward GV to. These seem to be working without trouble lately.
Or you can do both and use one DID or the other if one should break.
I see. Thank you.
I hope as we get closer to may, someone posts a tutorial with the options and steps to set it up :)
Your OBi via OBiTALK should handle the setup for Callcentric just fine.
As to Callcentric or IPKall, just visit their web pages and dive in. It's not complicated.
Quote from: gderf on November 12, 2013, 10:34:13 AMIf you forward calls from GV to another phone number that is provisioned on your OBi, incoming phone service will continue. You can get such a number for free from CallCentric. See: http://www.callcentric.com/dids/free_phone_number
To continue making free outbound calls from your OBi using Google Voice you can use GV's click to dial with callback from a web browser..
I get how to forward calls to the Callcentric free number, but as for outbound, I don't understand what you mean when you say, "To continue making free outbound calls from your OBi using Google Voice you can use GV's click to dial with callback from a web browser.."
Can someone please explain how to do this? I don't understand...
step 1 Log on to GV
step 2 Click call button
step 3 Enter # to call
step 4 click Connect
step 5 answer your phone when it rings
Quote from: N7AS on December 22, 2013, 11:16:55 PM
The GV number going direct to you OBi device will no longer work using XMPP. Your best bet would be with Localphone. A DID (phone number) is $0.99 per month. Inbound calls is free as well as outbound calls to toll free numbers. Outbound is $0.005 (1/2 cent) per min. They have subscriptions available.
For calls to US numbers.
250 min for $0.75 - $0.003 per min
800 min for $1.60 - $0.002 per min
5000 min for $5.00 - $0.001 per min
where do you see this ? "Outbound is $0.005 (1/2 cent) per min"
where are you seeing these rates ???
this is what i see:
https://db.tt/2OnQgsym
Quote from: ericab on March 19, 2014, 11:23:06 AM
Quote from: N7AS on December 22, 2013, 11:16:55 PM
The GV number going direct to you OBi device will no longer work using XMPP. Your best bet would be with Localphone. A DID (phone number) is $0.99 per month. Inbound calls is free as well as outbound calls to toll free numbers. Outbound is $0.005 (1/2 cent) per min. They have subscriptions available.
For calls to US numbers.
250 min for $0.75 - $0.003 per min
800 min for $1.60 - $0.002 per min
5000 min for $5.00 - $0.001 per min
where do you see this ? "Outbound is $0.005 (1/2 cent) per min"
where are you seeing these rates ???
this is what i see:
https://db.tt/2OnQgsym
Its called Monthly Subscriptions.
Click on Learn More then on the + sign next to US. The info will drop down with the rates.