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Obi 302?

Started by JeffDB, January 11, 2013, 03:45:37 PM

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JeffDB

I had read an online article about using OBi with Google Voice and browsed around here for a little while before deciding to buy a couple of OBi 202s.

I have two phone numbers for my small home/office and a fax line, but no landline really for our family. I had moved my office to my home and had to go with Vonage to be able to keep my old phone number. I had to use AT&T to get a new business line with a prefix that wouldn't be a long distance call in the area even though the move was only about 15 miles as a crow flies, and they really gigged me.

They required a 2 year contract and charged me more than double what they had quoted me originally. When the time was up I moved it also to Vonage but their prices had climbed a few times and my wife was not happy with the phone bills, so I finally moved my main new line to my cell phone (Sprint) & made it my cell number. I cancelled that Vonage line and had Google Voice simulring my other line, and had it simulring my Google Voice/cell phone.

It seemed to work pretty well and did drop my rates, but Vonage went up again and my bills have been ~$64/month which seemed high to me for a VOiP line & seldom used fax. OBi / Google Voice looked like a dream come true. I could set up my cell/GVoice line as line 1, my old landline as #2, my fax as #3 and a family line to boot, with no monthly phone bill. What a deal.

I browsed around the site here for a bit, looked over the products page http://www.obihai.com/product-primer.html and decided a couple of the Obi 202s would be perfect. I knew my wife, being quite the penny pincher, would be none too happy about buying them, but figured I'd bring her around once she saw it all set up and working and learned how much money it would save in the long run. So I clicked on a link to buy from Amazon, but made the mistake of searching there for a lower price. I found one a few dollars cheaper from one of their partners & went ahead and ordered a couple. Unfortunately, it looks like I made a big mistake.

I was excited when they arrived, and was happy at how simple it looked to set them up. I plugged everything in and was surprised to get a dial tone right away. I followed the instructions and got my login or password & was quite pleased to see it listed my model number, serial number etc. right away on the screen. Much less hassle than setting up most things I've done.

But then I got stuck. After doing a quick set up, I couldn't figure out how to configure it for Google Voice, or any other service provider for that matter. I found a tutorial on the site and followed along with it. Everything on their screenshots matched up with what I was seeing through the screenshot I've labeled as Obihai setup p1 http://tinyurl.com/cdhuwjo  . When I clicked on the "continue" button, however, I didn't get the screenshot they showed http://tinyurl.com/d4c6mce  (Obihai setup 2nd page). My screen was basically blank below the upper yellow line.

Reading further and looking through various other sources I came to find out that there's apparently another Obi product that is not listed on the products page, namely an Obi 302. At first I thought maybe I was lucky and got some new upgraded version that just came out, but no such luck. From what I gather, the OBi 302 is essentially a crippled OBi 202.

Is it true that the OBi 302 won't work with Google Voice? Can it be made to work, or am I just out the shipping costs for sending everything back?

Rick

If you ordered 202s and they shipped 302s, let Amazon know.  302s are for third parties to provision and appear to not include GV support.  Little discussion about them.

JeffDB

Quote from: Rick on January 11, 2013, 04:29:01 PM
If you ordered 202s and they shipped 302s, let Amazon know.  302s are for third parties to provision and appear to not include GV support.  Little discussion about them.

Unfortunately, I wasn't really paying attention to what the numbers were. I thought Obihai only made one 2 line device. I had searched for OBi 202, but a lot of times those searches do pull up similar devices.

Bummer.

I guess it's live and learn. I guess I got a little too excited and didn't read all the fine print, so to speak.

Ostracus

Has anyone tried flashing with 202 firmware? Maybe ask Obihai if they can do it?

giqcass

I was of the understanding the 302 is identical from a hardware point of view.  I'm sure you can fix the firmware to standard 202 if you consult Obihai.  I would open a support ticket with them.
Long live our new ObiLords!

JeffDB

Quote from: giqcass on January 11, 2013, 05:06:06 PM
I was of the understanding the 302 is identical from a hardware point of view.  I'm sure you can fix the firmware to standard 202 if you consult Obihai.  I would open a support ticket with them.

Thanks. I'll try that

JeffDB

Quote from: Ostracus on January 11, 2013, 04:52:46 PMHas anyone tried flashing with 202 firmware? Maybe ask Obihai if they can do it?

Thanks. I put in a support ticket.

The drop down list for the device didn't include a 302, however. On my first try it kicked out as an error because I selected a 202 and the device OBi # didn't match up with the OBi 202 I had selected from the drop down list. I had to redo it as "other".

It would be sweet if they could somehow "flash" it or whatever. Hopefully it is something they can and will do for me.

giqcass

#7
Like I said I would talk to them first but this is what I think they will have you do.
http://www.obihai.com/OBiAdminGuide.htm#_Toc333506080

Download the latest firmware for the 202.
http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=9.0

Go to the local admin page:
QuoteAccess the OBi Device Management Web Page:

1.       From a phone attached to the OBi, dial * * * to access the OBi Config Attendant.

2.       Choose "1" to hear the IP Address of the OBi read back to you. Write this down.

3.       Enter the OBi IP Address in a local PC web browser address field:

4.       When prompted, enter "admin" for user name and "admin" for password.

When you access the OBi device management web page, you will be prompted for a user name and password.  There are two levels of access to the OBi web page – User Level and Admin Level.  The default "user name / password" for User Level access is "user / user".  The default "user name / password" for Admin Level access is "admin / admin".  The Admin and/or User passwords may have been changed using the OBi device web page, provisioning by a service provider or via the OBiTALK web portal (Admin only).  Please be sure you have access to the correct Admin or User password before you attempt to log on to the OBi Device Management Web Page.

The OBi device management web page is organized into sections to allow for a manageable and compartmentalized approach to configuring the many hundreds of parameters available on the OBi device.  Use the expandable / collapsible menu tree on the left side of the page to easily navigate the various configuration parameter sections of the OBi device.

Then manually update.
Quote
Updating Firmware:

You may upgrade the firmware for your OBi device from the device configuration web page.  The firmware file with which you want to upgrade the device must be stored locally on a computer from which you can access with a web browser.

Follow these steps to upgrade:

Step 1:  Select the, "System Management – Device Update" menu on the side panel of the web page.

Step 2:  Specify the path of the firmware file by clicking the, "Select file to upgrade firmware" box or pressing the, "Browse" button in the Firmware Update section of the page.  This will present a file browser window where you can navigate to and select the firmware file.

Step 3:  Upon selection of the firmware file, press the "Update" button to start the upgrade process.

The entire process will take about 30 seconds to complete. Note that you MUST NOT disconnect the power from the device during this procedure. If the new firmware is upgraded successfully, the OBi device will reboot automatically to start running the new firmware. Otherwise the page will show an error message explaining why upgrade has failed.
Long live our new ObiLords!

giqcass

I did some more looking around and I think there might be some kind of a flag or jumper set on the device because it looks like the Obi302 and Obi202 are running the same firmware.  That suggests a regular or manual firmware update might not be enough to switch it over.  I bet there is a special file needed to make the switch.
Long live our new ObiLords!

JeffDB

Thanks for the info & all the work, giqcass.

Hopefully they'll be able to figure something out. It seems like a waste to have to be shipping them back & forth if the hardware is actually the same, or can be rectified/adjusted fairly easily.

I guess we'll see soon enough.

Fwiw, it does seem to me that if these are locked for specific providers they shouldn't be selling them on Amazon to the general public.

Anyway, thanks again.

Ostracus

They may be selling to the crowd that doesn't need GV although having it doesn't really take away anything from the Obi202. It's just software after all.

RFord

Isn't the OBi302 about $10 cheaper than the OBi202?  I doubt the OBi folks are going to make one-off changes to your device to change it from a 302 to 202.  Not only that, what would prevent users who got their device through a provider from making the same request so that their 302 can use GV? 

The whole point of making a 302 was to make the 202 acceptable to (paid) VOIP Providers.  The fact that you ignore the Amazon listing showing the OBi202 and gravitate to the lower price OBi302 and now expecting the manufacturer to do something special for you is utterly ridiculous.

JeffDB

Hi RFord, thanks for your thoughts and reply.

Quote from: RFord on January 12, 2013, 12:22:43 AMIsn't the OBi302 about $10 cheaper than the OBi202?  I doubt the OBi folks are going to make one-off changes to your device to change it from a 302 to 202.  Not only that, what would prevent users who got their device through a provider from making the same request so that their 302 can use GV?

Yes, it was a little cheaper than the original one that popped up through Amazon. As I recall, there was a link on the item for getting it through some of Amazon's partners, as well as links for items others bought for accessories and similar items  things like blue tooth adapters, wireless connectors, OBi 110 etc.

In the past I have purchased items from Amazon directly and other times through their partners, who sometimes have slightly better prices, or shipping deals etc. I thought that was the case here.

If they physical devices are the same, and the only difference is the software on it, I would certainly be willing to pay for the software upgrade, if that is what the price differential reflects.

It would certainly seem to make more sense to just update the software electronically than to ship the two units back, have them repackage and restock it, and then sell them to someone else; and perhaps buy two new physically identical units with the software upgrade on them and have them shipped back to me again.

Quote from: RFord on January 12, 2013, 12:22:43 AMThe whole point of making a 302 was to make the 202 acceptable to (paid) VOIP Providers.

Although I personally abhor that business model of selling crippled equipment that will only work with one provider's services, I can certainly understand why Obihai would make them to meet a particular customer's (service providers using such a business model) demand.

I personally try and jump through hoops to avoid dealing with companies that use such a service model, but that isn't always doable or practical.

It would be pretty stupid, in my opinion, for people to want to go with a similar business model for most purchases. I wouldn't buy a lawnmower subsidized by Mobil but that could only use Mobil gasoline. But some battery company is trying to set up a business model where they partner with electric car companies such that the customers pay a monthly fee and they will set up recharging stations around the country and people can pull in, have the batteries switched out in a few minutes with fully charged ones.

It sounds pretty handy, and a lot more practical than trying to recharge them for hours at every stop on a long distance trip. The drawback is that they are to be tied to their proprietary system for the life of the vehicle. If things look good now, but prices rise dramatically, you're stuck. If the company goes out of business, who knows? Maybe someone else may buy them out and can make that business model work, or you may be stuck with a vehicle dropping very rapidly in value and utility.

I have two perfectly good scanners that are paperweights because the software can't be transferred to a new computer. I had another software company that fought me tooth and nail when I moved my office to my home. They had locked my old address into it and any documents I printed out had the old address on them. The software wouldn't allow me to change it and they refused to do so, at first, unless I paid a few hundred dollars for their newer version. I wasn't very happy with the utility of the software anyway, and had purchased it at the time specifically because they had promised me that I owned it, rather than leasing it from them, and that I did not have to pay monthly fees to use it like most of their competitors' business models.

They finally relented, but then I had the same issue when I bought a new computer. They wouldn't let me move it to the new computer and refused to budge. That was the 2nd fairly expensive piece of software that I had purchased from them but it is most certainly the last. They still send me marketing pieces for new software, and have even called a couple of times despite my rather vehement requests to leave me alone and promises I will never deal with them again as long as I live.

But I realize my own thoughts on the subject are not everyone's, and companies are free to use whatever business model they like, and customers will vote with their wallets for the best ones, as they say. I'm fine with that.

Quote from: RFord on January 12, 2013, 12:22:43 AMThe fact that you ignore the Amazon listing showing the OBi202 and gravitate to the lower price OBi302 and now expecting the manufacturer to do something special for you is utterly ridiculous.

Yeah, I've admitted a few times, I believe, that I messed up. In my defense, however, I think there are some mitigating circumstances. The original article I read http://tinyurl.com/67qumzk that brought me to Obhai never mentioned that some of their models were locked and others weren't. But more importantly in my mind, the Obihai products page http://tinyurl.com/7v4wqa2 doesn't list the OBi 302, nor does it make any mention of any of their devices that are locked, or that will not work with GV or some providers but not others.

As far as I knew from their website, they only had three ATA devices, two that provided 1 PSTN line, and one, the OBi202 that provided 2 lines. Every device listed on their products page, and as far as I can tell, anywhere else on their website said that each device was unlocked and would work with Google Voice and any other service provider that did not specifically require their own proprietary setup, and allowed a "Bring Your Own Device" option.

When I went to Amazon and did the search, I opened probably 10 tabs and read through a few reviews and compared prices, shipping charges etc. My big mistake was in assuming that all of their products were listed on their products page, and not paying attention to model numbers, and reading through the details on the page from the supplier I had eventually settled upon. I didn't notice the difference between the rather similar OBi202 and OBi302. I had looked at multiple other pages of other phone systems etc. and all the model numbers tend to flow by me like water off a duck's back after awhile. I had read through all of the detail on some of the pages, but they all looked like duplicates to me, other than who the seller was. I knew it was a two line OBi, and as far as I knew there was only one of those so I finally settled on one and ordered before I went to bed late that night.

As I had mentioned earlier, it does seem to me that these OBi302 models shouldn't be sold to the general public through Amazon or eBay or whatever. As far as I can tell this model won't work with ANY provider. There are no options whatsover in the dropdown list for providers. The customers for these things wouldn't seem to be the general public, but rather the service providers themselves. If people are getting subsidized, crippled versions they usually receive them directly from their service provider once they've completed a contract. I doubt Vonage or Broadvoice or whomever is going to tell their clients to go buy an OBi on Amazon or eBay and then they'll configure it remotely for them.

Live and learn, I guess. Caveat emptor and all that. Maybe it is "utterly ridiculous" to ask them to try and fix my mistake by allowing me to reload/update the software (for a fee if need be), but it doesn't seem that way to me, biased though I may be.

Worst case scenario is probably that they will tell me "no". I would hope they won't tell me to go away and never come back as they never want me as a customer ever again.

I guess I'll find out soon enough.

Rick

You do realize that you didn't buy from OBi, right?  The SELLER you bought from is the one that you have the issue with, not OBi.  I can't believe OBi would offer you any ways to change a 302 to a 202, as that would undermine their resellers...

JeffDB

Quote from: Rick on January 12, 2013, 10:01:16 AM
You do realize that you didn't buy from OBi, right?  The SELLER you bought from is the one that you have the issue with, not OBi.  I can't believe OBi would offer you any ways to change a 302 to a 202, as that would undermine their resellers...

You're right. They emailed me saying that the Amazon page said that it was a service provider only product and that there was no way to change it.

My bad.

I'll just have to ship them back.

giqcass

Well that's too bad.  :-[  I understand from a business standpoint why they can't fix the issue for you.  I guess we have all learned something here and at least we can pass it on to others so they don't make the same mistake.  I hope you get your 202s soon so you can join the rest of us in Obitopia.  I have had a lot of fun with mine by messing around with the advanced settings and dial plans.
Long live our new ObiLords!

JeffDB

Quote from: giqcass on January 12, 2013, 12:13:39 PMWell that's too bad.  :-[  I understand from a business standpoint why they can't fix the issue for you.  I guess we have all learned something here and at least we can pass it on to others so they don't make the same mistake.  I hope you get your 202s soon so you can join the rest of us in Obitopia.  I have had a lot of fun with mine by messing around with the advanced settings and dial plans.

Thanks giqcass. From the little I've seen on here, and although it's mostly over my head at the moment, it does look like there's an awful lot of flexibility with these units.

I'll have to reevaluate my needs a bit, though to see what my needs are. I had originally planned on using one of the jacks for a dedicated fax line, but I learned on here that Google Voice might not work so well for that so I ended up getting a Magic Jack Plus for that task and it seems to be working well so far in the couple of tests I ran with it.

My wife will be crabbing about the extra shipping fees I incurred, and Vonage ended up dropping my remaining line there from $25.99/mo to $9.99/mo to keep me there after I dropped the fax line & toll free number. That will be quite a drop from the $64.xx I had been paying with the fax line & 800#. They estimated it will still be ~ $15/mo with all of their line charges & 911 etc., but even adding in the Magic Jack it still saves me enough to pay for the wireless card which was my original goal.

I might just get one and scale back, forgetting about adding a family line. But I think I'll also probably start another thread to figure out a few other things. For instance, whether the OBi can forward a Google Voice only number to my cell phone, which is already my Sprint/Google Voice number. If not, that would be a big drawback to converting that final Vonage number, which does simulring my cell phone currently.

But the OBi does look like a very interesting device. Hopefully I'll be back trying to figure out all of the ways to tweak it to do new tricks with the rest of you guys.

Thanks again for all the help.