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Please, in the simplest possible terms, explain what this means ??

Started by vtsnaab, April 17, 2014, 09:11:54 PM

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vtsnaab

I have read every topic name and all the pages of this sub-forum today & tonight trying to grasp this situation and find the best alternative to GV.

For years I've enjoyed having 2 GV numbers via my Obi110 and knew the ride would one day end.

Despite reading so many postings here, the blog, etc - I cannot claim to comprehend what will be lost - what will stay working, and what must be replaced very clearly at all.

Thus far...IF it needs total replacement:
My inclination is to just get Future-Five because it looks great to me.
2nd runner up would be the PIAF deal with Vitelity if it has enough of everything included...
And finally if all else fails, VOIP.MS looks good & also is cheap.

-BUT-:
There's also mention of doing other stuff like using Callcentric, as mentioned here=>
http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=7675.0

All this is just too unclear to me - will incoming calls cease to work - outgoing - or both ??

I'd love to have another free alternative, but always figured that some time would come to pay for phone again and that's really OK as long as it is reasonable and the Future-Five deal looks to be super reasonable to me - I have only to compare it with whatever Vitelity is offering as 'unlimited'...

But first I really need to know if this loss of GV means that it is ALL done, or just part of it - so please, will someone explain this in simple, concise words for a dummy like me ??

Thanks.

SteveInWA

If you haven't been able to understand the many, many discussions on this topic already, why are you getting stuck in analysis paralysis over it?

It's over.  Done.  No more free ride.  Google Voice is shutting down Google Chat on 5/15, which used the XMPP protocol.  Google Voice used Chat for its internet (VoIP) calling features.  OBi was using XMPP to access Chat (which, by the way, was never authorized or supported by Google).

The alternatives have been discussed to death here.  You don't need yet another thread, where 15 different people will give you 15 more opinions on their personal choices.

Just make a decision.  See, for example:

http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=7719.msg49922#msg49922

nitzan

Quote from: vtsnaab on April 17, 2014, 09:11:54 PM
But first I really need to know if this loss of GV means that it is ALL done, or just part of it - so please, will someone explain this in simple, concise words for a dummy like me ??
In simple terms, what will happen is:
1. You will not be able to make outgoing calls or receive incoming calls via your Obi directly to/from GV.
2. You WILL be able to forward your GV number to another phone number.

Now your choices are:
1. Get a new phone number from another provider, and forward your GV to that number.
2. Port your GV number to another provider.

Google Voice isn't completely shutting down - at least not yet. Just the ability to use it directly from your Obi is shutting down. I would personally recommend porting the number for best quality and reliability.
Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation
http://www.future-nine.com/

vtsnaab

Thank You Very Much Nitzan - that was the EXACT clarity that I was hoping for.

I admit that I do tend to be a bit too literal and sometimes when a problem/solution is stated so very many different ways by so many folks and with different opinions attached - I can get confused.

Also worthy of mention IMO is that all the talk of partial solutions complicated things as well - making me think that maybe only PART of the service would become un-usable.

Gone is gone though - and I'm good with that.

My compliments to you Nitzan on your fine service offering and your willingness to assist - it speaks well in the interest of using your service above the others, I think.

danielbliss

Just to offer a second opinion: depending on your needs (mine are quite minimal; I'm not all that concerned about call quality), I find GV-forwarding a better option than porting my GV number.  Why?  Because porting always entails costs, and by porting the number, you are now bound to the provider to which you ported: if you find you don't like the provider, or they go out of business, you must either port the number again (at more cost) or lose it.  One of the big advantages to GV (again, for me) is that I never have to give out another number to anyone: I can just forward or unforward to whatever phones and always retain the GV number as my phone number of record. 

vtsnaab

Thank You Danielbliss.
I see your point and I think it is well made.

A corollary to your point is that just as the big G is ditching what we were using - it can just as easily ditch all it's numbers at some future point most likely - it is a powerful force in the IT world.

Some of the offers also include free porting, and 2 points of opinion I would add:
- If one chooses a company that seems solid and has been around a while that may be enough.
- Personally, I will enjoy having the big G less involved in my life & affairs.

T'was good while free & available, but getting done is also a very good thing, I think.

CLTGreg

Google is not going to simply pull the plug on Voice without a massive heads-up. Look how long we've been suffering talking about it. Sometimes it's better to pull the band-aid off in one tug but alas we are going to miss this one.

When GV buys it, it will probably go to Hangouts or something and you'll be able to use the number there and the worse case it will be VOIP only with no forwarding. I expect SMS will continue.

You mention the size and you're right about G being massive right now but no way would I port my number to a smaller provider as many are fledgling. I have a number than has three repeating zeros at the end and that's gold to me. The only way I can see porting to be a good idea as long as GV is alive is if you have latency problems. I don't. I would like to apologize for that  ;D

danielbliss

I love my GV number as well: it's the same as my cell phone number, but with two digits transposed.  I thought this would make me look really cool at first, but no one but me seems to be impressed with it.  :-\ 

SteveInWA

I rest my case, about yet another rambling, redundant thread.

Nitzan simply described what we've already stated in at least a half-dozen previous threads; thanks for patiently doing that!

No, Google Voice is not shutting down, period.  The blog-o-sphere is full of chicken little gossip about this, and none of the bloggers know anything other than how to plagiarize and repeat each other's blogs.

I do work directly with Google engineering, and I can assure you that the Google Voice service is being continually worked on, supported and improved.  Millions of people use it, and there is no way Google is going to endure the s*%t-storm in the press that would occur if it was shut off.  Google needs GV to be competitive with Microsoft, Facebook and Apple.

All that is happening is the May 15th shut-down of XMPP, and the eventual integration of the GV and Hangouts user interfaces, for the better.  The current, separate GV and Hangouts mobile apps are confusing, fragmented, and downright crummy.  Those will be eventually merged.  GV, as a service will continue to exist, with all its features.

Speaking of May 15th, yes, the death sentence will be carried out.  There are no appeals to the Supreme Court, and no clemency by the Governor.  The plan is on track.  If anyone is still in denial about this, it's time to get over it and get on with it.

SkOrPn

Quote from: danielbliss on April 18, 2014, 08:16:39 AM
Just to offer a second opinion: depending on your needs (mine are quite minimal; I'm not all that concerned about call quality), I find GV-forwarding a better option than porting my GV number.  Why?  Because porting always entails costs, and by porting the number, you are now bound to the provider to which you ported: if you find you don't like the provider, or they go out of business, you must either port the number again (at more cost) or lose it.  One of the big advantages to GV (again, for me) is that I never have to give out another number to anyone: I can just forward or unforward to whatever phones and always retain the GV number as my phone number of record. 

That is what I was thinking exactly. Plus if I was to port my GV number over to VOIP.ms, then wouldn't I also lose my ability to use the Google Voice websites texting feature? I like using that simple website, it makes texting while working a breeze.

nitzan

Quote from: danielbliss on April 18, 2014, 08:16:39 AMBecause porting always entails costs, and by porting the number, you are now bound to the provider to which you ported: if you find you don't like the provider, or they go out of business, you must either port the number again (at more cost) or lose it.
While I understand your logic, let's keep two things in mind:
1. Some providers are offering free/cheap porting right now.
2. Many of the providers discussed here have been in business longer than Google Voice existed. Examples: CallCentric, Voip.MS, Future Nine, Phone Power

Having said that, the most popular providers here (mostly due to cost I assume) have only exited for a very short time. Specifically Intelafone/ObiVoice/VestaLink has only existed for 3 months in it's current form, and a few years before that as a completely unknown company. CircleNet is brand new - although they don't do incoming currently. Anveo has been around since 2010.
Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation
http://www.future-nine.com/

vtsnaab

#11
Once again I thank you Nitzan, for your polite, patient helpfulness !!!

IMO, forums such as this exist for the help that folks may give freely to one another.

Too much of the time that spirit is corrupted by hyper-critical (and even snarky) posts that help nobody a'tall.

It is always such a pleasure to share 'space' with folks who explain freely and without unhelpful criticism; no matter how many times & permutations of something that may have been asked before.

Kudos to ALL such wonderfully helpful sorts of folks, and thanks.

SkOrPn

Quote from: nitzan on April 19, 2014, 03:14:19 AM
1. Some providers are offering free/cheap porting right now.
2. Many of the providers discussed here have been in business longer than Google Voice existed. Examples: Voip.MS

I know when I was chatting with the VOIP.ms tech he specifically told me he would port my GV number for free. Not sure if that was based on me being interested in the Premium service or not, but it is highly appreciated none the less. Even though I probably won't be using it any time soon. I want to keep my GV website working as-is as long as possible.

nitzan

Quote from: SkOrPn on April 19, 2014, 01:19:21 PMEven though I probably won't be using it any time soon. I want to keep my GV website working as-is as long as possible.
Just keep in mind porting won't be free forever. We (providers) do have to pay our carriers around $10 for porting numbers usually - the current free porting offers will likely disappear after May 15th, or even before that. Our own free porting offer is only valid until the end of April - at that point we'll reevaluate and decide if we'll extend it or keep it free for a few more weeks.
Nitzan Kon, CEO
Future Nine Corporation
http://www.future-nine.com/

SkOrPn

Quote from: nitzan on April 19, 2014, 01:36:51 PM
Quote from: SkOrPn on April 19, 2014, 01:19:21 PMEven though I probably won't be using it any time soon. I want to keep my GV website working as-is as long as possible.
Just keep in mind porting won't be free forever. We (providers) do have to pay our carriers around $10 for porting numbers usually - the current free porting offers will likely disappear after May 15th, or even before that. Our own free porting offer is only valid until the end of April - at that point we'll reevaluate and decide if we'll extend it or keep it free for a few more weeks.
Thanks for the heads up...


SteveInWA

Quote from: vtsnaab on April 19, 2014, 10:20:25 AM
Once again I thank you Nitzan, for your polite, patient helpfulness !!!

IMO, forums such as this exist for the help that folks may give freely to one another.

Too much of the time that spirit is corrupted by hyper-critical (and even snarky) posts that help nobody a'tall.

It is always such a pleasure to share 'space' with folks who explain freely and without unhelpful criticism; no matter how many times & permutations of something that may have been asked before.

Kudos to ALL such wonderfully helpful sorts of folks, and thanks.

I'm sorry that you were put-off by my snarky comments.  But, my annoyance was because, in fact a large percentage of this forum has already been filled with answers to the same questions you were asking.  Out of common courtesy to the people who do answer questions, it's just good forum etiquette to respect people's time and do some reading first.   This forum isn't easy to search, granted, but creating yet another redundant thread just makes that information more fragmented (as opposed to adding onto an existing thread on the subject, if your questions weren't answered).  Thanks.

vtsnaab

Seeing as this thread has drawn no further replies for a while - and for the sake of utter clarity, I re-post this from my OP here=>
Quote from: vtsnaab on April 17, 2014, 09:11:54 PM
I have read every topic name and all the pages of this sub-forum today & tonight trying to grasp this situation and find the best alternative to GV.

For years I've enjoyed having 2 GV numbers via my Obi110 and knew the ride would one day end.

Despite reading so many postings here, the blog, etc - I cannot claim to comprehend what will be lost - what will stay working, and what must be replaced very clearly at all.

Then this, from the posting above, which says in part:
QuoteOut of common courtesy to the people who do answer questions, it's just good forum etiquette to respect people's time and do some reading first.

And I reply to that assertion thusly=>
I have read and read and read until my eyes could read not even one more word - and have been checking this forum and many other info sources for many WEEKS already.
The OP of this thread was posted by me for the exact reasons stated AFTER already doing a huge amount of reading - and I am still studying what info as I may find.

So I thank you for the explanation for your personal ire, SteveInWA and also wonder if you were chastening me in some official capacity here, or just exercising your rights of free speech ??

At any event I thank you and wish all here well in the quest for good phone-via-internet !!!

classpro

No one knows what the future of GV will be.  Maybe they will start charging for forwarding at some point.  Maybe they will come out with their own device for home phone service.  It's really hard to know. 

What I am trying to do is look at what is available now and make the best decision, which for me is generally the cheapest option.  That's a free incoming line from CallCentric, and outgoing by the minute at very low rates from CircleNet, and keeping GV for forwarding.  I can always port my GV number later if GV forwarding gets expensive.  I can always pay for a full incoming and outgoing service if CallCentric eliminates free incoming lines.  But if things stay the same, this should work. 

I am trying to figure out how to use CircleNet to spoof my different incoming numbers (wife home, me home, work) when calling out, but it's not working yet.  Circlenet has been really nice about helping, so I feel good about that. 

Incoming on two separate google voice lines through 2 Circlenet numbers is working.  Outgoing works from Circlenet spoofing my wife's telephone number.  Setup programming is a bit tricky, but there is help on the forums.

Terry

Quote from: vtsnaab on May 02, 2014, 09:49:11 AM
And I reply to that assertion thusly=>
I have read and read and read until my eyes could read not even one more word - and have been checking this forum and many other info sources for many WEEKS already.
The OP of this thread was posted by me for the exact reasons stated AFTER already doing a huge amount of reading - and I am still studying what info as I may find.

I'm not clear on what you (as the OP) have concluded from this topic, or your research, thus far, if anything.

I assume that you know that you soon won't be able to use a GV account directly on your Obi as before -- it won't connect, won't make outgoing calls, won't receive calls, so you might as well delete it from the Obi when GV stops supporting XMPP.  (Probably should delete it, for security and other reasons.)

One might conclude, therefore, that to continue using the Obi device, one must get a SIP/VOIP provider, which will likely not be entirely free of cost.

Your GV account(s) will still work, still record voicemail, still forward calls to a phone number (e.g. your cell phone, or a landline), still forward calls to Google talk/chat on your PC, and so forth, at least as far as I know. In short, anything you can do now via your GV web page will continue to work, until Google gives notice that it will change. (There's nothing you have been doing with your GV web page that has anything directly to do with your Obi.)

I assume also that you know that GV has not announced that it will stop forwarding to phone numbers (it's one of the things you can do on your GV web page), so any VOIP service you put on your Obi that includes a (US) phone number, can be the target of that forwarding. Maybe GV will stop forwarding or charge for it, maybe not; but I'd expect them to give us months of notice either way.

Are my assumptions wrong, and you are not convinced of any of those statements? Is the issue that those making such statements could be just making up what they (we) are saying, and you need something closer to a reference to a primary source before you will believe it? Or do you agree with the statements, but have other questions that are included in your original posting that are not covered by my statements and assumptions?

In a sense, once GV stops being a direct option on the Obi device, it opens up all sorts of other options, such as selection of a SIP/VOIP provider and what features to purchase. Maybe too many options, too much flexibility? Too many providers and not enough comparative objective reviews? Too many very technical options?

Perhaps your restatement of the OP question could include a summary (in your own words) of what you think has been communicated clearly and authoritatively, and what yet remains unanswered or at least not reliably answered to your satisfaction.


vtsnaab

#19
Hi Terry.
When I posted this thread I was unclear about just how much of the GV/Obi connection was about to cease - and Nitzan's reply stated it in helpfully clear language for me - which is to say - all of it.

You have re-stated this very clearly also, thank you.

As of now my thoughts are to go with some cheap and/or free services, get a new incoming number and leave the GV stuff sort of off to one side (just as it is) to receive SMSs & VMs at the very least, and if I am able to make it work on an Android phone as well (via Wifi) I will do that.

As I see it, barring something really great happening from the 'Big G', I will most likely gradually phase out my usage of their services as much as possible over time.

I was originally hoping to easily keep my 'main' GV number going along with some easy means to use SMS over that same number - but since that seems unlikely I can just as easily move on to other things.

Thanks, and Best Wishes !!