I am new to the voip/ata concept, so I thought I would ask a few questions. I am considering getting an Obi202 to replace 2 infrequently used landlines (separate numbers/different users). The logical placement for the Obi202 is out in the garage where the two phone lines originate. I would just unplug those lines from the Cox NIU and plug them into the Obi, with a 50ft run of Cat5 to reach my router. The only time I ever expect to need to look at the Obi box is during setup or for (hopefully rare) problem solving.
Is this a reasonable expectation?
I did consider the Ooma Telo, but it does not have two RJ11's (requires a separate linx box), and it sounds like both parties need access to the telo to see the VM indicator (if I actually wanted to use VM).
I have 2 existing cordless answering machines ATT CL82351, that work well, so I won't be using any forwarding, multi-ring, or VM features that may be available to me, at least not initially. In fact it is important I be able to completely disable any VM feature initially, and not just by having my machine pick up sooner than the VM. If my equip does not answer the call, it should go unanswered. I really just want reliable duplication of the basic landline functionality I have now without any need for web access, once it is all setup.
Is what I describe a reasonable expectation? I ask this because a lot of the posts suggest that the whole voip/ata thing becomes an ongoing hobby for some instead of a tool that just works.
It is pretty simple to set up an Obi
Can't you put the Obi next to the router, and run a phone wire near the Obi?
be sure and disconnect your phone wire(s) from the outside network interface
It is cleaner and easier to add one more run of cat5, than to reroute two existing phone lines that go all over.
To restate my questions:
Do users find that they need constant access to the obi to check the lights or reset it, or do they find it can be put away out of sight once it is working?
Are there settings in the obi that allow you to completely disable voice mail and voice mail indication so that a regular answering machine can continue to work without problems?
Yes, it will work fine with a minimum of effort. You might have to power cycle it once in a great while.
Plugging it in to a UPS is a good idea.
Voicemail is a function of your VOIP provider, not the Obi
I use a regular answering machine (you know, the kind that uses wire to record sound?) ;)
The nice thing about a 202 is that you can make and receive calls on two separate phone systems at the same time.
(I do not use the router function of the 202)
There are a lot of advanced users on this forum who set up digit maps, etc etc.
I just use Obitalk to enter the initial setup info, and manage my Obi's and to set up speed dials, decide which numbers should ring on which jacks etc.
Quote from: tns1 on February 28, 2015, 02:36:24 PM
I am new to the voip/ata concept, so I thought I would ask a few questions. I am considering getting an Obi202 to replace 2 infrequently used landlines (separate numbers/different users). The logical placement for the Obi202 is out in the garage where the two phone lines originate. I would just unplug those lines from the Cox NIU and plug them into the Obi, with a 50ft run of Cat5 to reach my router. The only time I ever expect to need to look at the Obi box is during setup or for (hopefully rare) problem solving.
Is this a reasonable expectation?
I did consider the Ooma Telo, but it does not have two RJ11's (requires a separate linx box), and it sounds like both parties need access to the telo to see the VM indicator (if I actually wanted to use VM).
I have 2 existing cordless answering machines ATT CL82351, that work well, so I won't be using any forwarding, multi-ring, or VM features that may be available to me, at least not initially. In fact it is important I be able to completely disable any VM feature initially, and not just by having my machine pick up sooner than the VM. If my equip does not answer the call, it should go unanswered. I really just want reliable duplication of the basic landline functionality I have now without any need for web access, once it is all setup.
Is what I describe a reasonable expectation? I ask this because a lot of the posts suggest that the whole voip/ata thing becomes an ongoing hobby for some instead of a tool that just works.
That's a great observation, as you can see from some of the posts here, and on other forums. It
can become a "hobby", or you can just install it like an appliance, and let it work. Obihai has made it relatively easy for a newbie to set up the device, and then forget about it, for the most part. As dircom said, plug it into a UPS, to avoid issues caused by momentary power line glitches, and to provide power surge protection.
I moved my 202 down into the basement many months ago, where it has access to both LAN and my home's telephone wiring, and I haven't had to "visit" it yet. Device resets/reboots and other maintenance can be performed either from the attached telephone lines, or via the website.
One key to satisfying service is selecting a reliable Internet Telephone Service Provider (ITSP). There's plenty of back-and-forth debate here, but most users are satisfied with ITSPs who are large enough to have a good-sized, responsive support staff and years of experience as a service provider. There are very small, cheaper providers out there, but it's worth it to spend a bit more money if you're trying to duplicate the POTS or cable company experience. Most people here are very satisfied with Callcentric, voip.ms and Phonepower, for example.
I am looking at Anveo and Voip.ms since they seem popular. Anveo does a slightly better job showing you a complete packages. They could both improve their sites dramatically by just having a page where you could select the options you want, plug in your expected usage, and have it show you estimated cost. Instead you have to visit several pages to hunt for the info.
If I end up using one of the approved providers via Obitalk, it looks like I have to enable remote configuration. Do I need to leave it like this, or can I disable it afterwards and get to the config pages via the LAN port?
If you use the approved service provider plans, then you need to use the OBiTALK portal. You can still make configuration changes from the portal's expert config mode, though. If your goal is a basic, "set it and forget it" telephone service replacement, then this isn't really a big deal.
Quote from: tns1 on March 01, 2015, 12:36:45 PM
If I end up using one of the approved providers via Obitalk, it looks like I have to enable remote configuration. Do I need to leave it like this, or can I disable it afterwards and get to the config pages via the LAN port?
You just have to disable OBiTalk provisioning then switch to the local interface for configuring.
Going back to OBiTalk is a little more complicated. You have to take a configuration backup then import the configuration into OBiTalk. The backup does not contain passwords, so the OBitalk configuration will now match the OBi's except for passwords. Turn OBiTalk provisioning on.
Robert, are you sure you can do that with a device that's on an approved service provider-managed plan? I haven't used one of those plans. I've read on Phonepower's website that you can make config changes, but I don't know what the behavior would be if you tried to disable remote provisioning, use the local interface, etc. as in your post. At minimum, restoring the local config might delete the managed service provider info and require that the device be re-synced with the provider.
I didn't get into any of this with the OP because his point was, to use this as a telephone, not as a hobby.
When picking a provider, some plans talk about supporting a certain number of 'channels', which I gather is the number of simultaneous calls. One channel would mean that callers get a busy signal if you are already on the phone. Two channels would allow call waiting, or going to VM in that situation.
Some plans mention that 2 users/SIP accounts are included. Does this mean 2 phone numbers are supported, or two different billing statements, or?
Sub-accounts are sometimes included. What does that do for you?
Is there any technical difference between a local DID number I get from a provider, and my ported landline#?
Generic (ookla) voip tests show I am getting > 25mbps, 20ms pings, 5ms jitter and no errors. Are there known ISPs that the Obi ATA does not work well with due to voip traffic throttling or other issues?
Quote from: tns1 on March 01, 2015, 05:29:46 PM
When picking a provider, some plans talk about supporting a certain number of 'channels', which I gather is the number of simultaneous calls. One channel would mean that callers get a busy signal if you are already on the phone. Two channels would allow call waiting, or going to VM in that situation.
Some plans mention that 2 users/SIP accounts are included. Does this mean 2 phone numbers are supported, or two different billing statements, or?
Sub-accounts are sometimes included. What does that do for you?
Is there any technical difference between a local DID number I get from a provider, and my ported landline#?
Generic (ookla) voip tests show I am getting > 25mbps, 20ms pings, 5ms jitter and no errors. Are there known ISPs that the Obi ATA does not work well with due to voip traffic throttling or other issues?
Some of these questions are best answered by the VoIP provider of your choice. I'll try to answer the channels question. With 2 channels, you can have two separate VoIP (or telephone) lines if your device supports it. For example, you can receive one call on one channel and someone can still make a separate call on a second channel (second line) of the same VoIP service. The Obi200 has only one port, so I don't think 2 channels will make much difference. The Obi202 could work...but since I don't have the 202...I don't know for sure.
What I do have is SIP trunks in my VoIP PBX and so if I have 4 channels from the VoIP provider, I can technically receive four calls simultaneously, etc.
As for locally ported DIDs and ones you obtain from the provider, they should all be similar in that they are DIDs--telephone numbers.
>>When picking a provider, some plans talk about supporting a certain number of 'channels', which I gather is the number of simultaneous calls. One channel would mean that callers get a busy signal if you are already on the phone. Two channels would allow call waiting, or going to VM in that situation.
Correct.
>>Some plans mention that 2 users/SIP accounts are included. Does this mean 2 phone numbers are supported, or two different billing statements, or?
Sub-accounts are sometimes included. What does that do for you?
You get an account with a provider to use their service (1 billing statement). That typically includes 1 configurable voice service/SIP account. It may include additional sub-accounts as additional configurable voice services/SIP accounts. You typically need 1 voice service/SIP account for each individual end user/device... set of phones on 1 'line', 1 softphone on a mobile device, etc.
The OBi202 can be configured for 4 voice services/SIP accounts and 2 end user devices/phones/lines... you'll use 1 voice service/SIP account for each PHONE port to have 2 different phone 'lines'.
A DID can ring one or more voice services/SIP accounts... 1 DID can ring all SIP accounts; 5 DIDs can all ring the same 1 account. You can wire it up how you want it, depending on the provider and practical usage. The typical configuration is to mimic traditional phone service and go from there: did1 >> SIP account1 >> phonejack1.
A voice service/SIP account can carry unlimited SIP sessions/channels subject to the rate plan. So, 1 voice service/SIP account can have many calls in progress, subject to the channels and bandwidth available, and the physical practicalities of the endpoint... an OBi202 with 2 PHONE jacks can only connect 2 users/lines/sets of phones.
>>Is there any technical difference between a local DID number I get from a provider, and my ported landline#?
No.
>>Generic (ookla) voip tests show I am getting > 25mbps, 20ms pings, 5ms jitter and no errors. Are there known ISPs that the Obi ATA does not work well with due to voip traffic throttling or other issues?
Probably. You'll have to try it to find out. Your router is also significant... it must pass SIP traffic without fault.
DIY BYOD VoIP makes it a hobby. VoIP is not POTS. If you go this route and set it up, you will be the one supporting it on your network. Once established, it can be as reliable as any other computing device on your network using an online service 24x7.
I have been using VOIP.ms for over a year with great success. I just added a fourth DID. The website is feature rich with a Wiki that explains things fairly well. Live chat works well and the porting dept. is very cooperative. In my investigation of VOIP.ms vs Anveo I found VOIP.ms more desirable for my needs.
My experience is that the features available via VOIP.ms and Obi with the ability to configure and manage my own service with support from this forum is far superior to the off shore "support" from Verizon, Comcast/Xfinity, etc.
Yes, if and when the internet goes down phone service goes down. Security systems should not be connected to VOIP the communication between the alarm panel and the central station is typically unreliable. I added a cellular communicator to my security system.
Good Luck!
Obi202 just arrived. Set it up via Obitalk 'dashboard' and successfully called the test#. I took a look at the settings via 'Expert Config' in Obitalk but didn't change anything yet. I also took a look via the device manager config pages. Funny how the ***0,30# is missing from the quick start guide.
When I do a ***0,6# to check FW, it says 'not available', yet I can see there is a newer 3.0.1.4581 (http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=9.0) to replace the 3.0.1.4477 that it shipped with. So should I hold off updating? Are there stable vs intermediate versions? Is there a changelog for each version?
The quickstart guide says I can call any Obi without any further setup. Since the 202 has 2 phone jacks, is there a way phone1 can call phone2, by using a suffix like '**9xxxxxxxxx:2' ? If so, it would be a nice testing method that does not need a provider.
Just dial # from either phone port to call the other.
Edit:
In OBi Expert look at the following:
Physical Interfaces -> Phone1/2 Port -> OutboundCallRoute
You will see these rules
Phone1 - {(<#:>):ph2}
Phone2 - {(<#:>):ph}
QuoteJust dial # from either phone port to call the other.
What is the call routing on this? If it is all internal to the Obi, that only tests your local phones and wiring. I was looking more for a call test that went out to a voip server and back so you could use it to tweak your network config. I am assuming that all obi-to-obi calls go thru obihai servers - is that right?.
Yes, it is an internal OBi call.
To call another OBi over OBiTalk network dial **9510123456
510123456 is the OBi Number of the OBi you want to call.
Unfortunately, you cannot call yourself with this method.
Log into OBiTalk with a Web browser that supports WebRTC.
I use Chrome.
Click on the green Call OBi Button.
There should be a speed dial in the drop down menu for your OBi202.
If not, type you OBi Number.
Click Call.
RE: firmware, it's routine that newer firmware is released after products are manufactured and shipped. The latest version of the firmware came out last month. You can easily upgrade the firmware; just read and follow the information in this post (which includes release notes):
http://www.obitalk.com/forum/index.php?topic=8982.msg59541#msg59541
RE: testing, you should be able to call the OBi echo test number from your device; that's a sufficient test. Note that the test number goes down periodically, usually over weekends, so don't panic if it doesn't work.
Time to select your ITSP and get it working!
OK, updated the FW ok, and I can ring and connect phone1<->phone2 each way. What I cannot do is get 'Call Obi' to make a successful call. I first tried calling the Obitalk test#.
Calling from my PC, I can hear it ringing on my pc speaker, and after a couple of rings it says "connected", but I do not hear the test message on my PC speaker.
When I call my Obi, the connected handset does not ring.
This is where things diverge from being an appliance to being a hobby. If your OBi device appears on your OBiTALK portal page, and you were able to upgrade the firmware, and you can call the **9 222 222 222 echo test number, then it's ready to use. I suggest that you simply sign up with your ITSP of choice, and use that service, rather than spin your wheels with further testing.
The Obi echo test# does not sound particularly clear. There is a background hiss I wouldn't want to hear all the time. If this is indicative of call quality, do users find that adding a filtered phone cord helps?
I notice that some have posted latency #s for their actual connections. Is there some tool or automated method to measure this? Short of calling all your friends and a bunch of random 800 numbers in different states, are there numbers that will give an automatic callback with a recording? I seem to remember something like this existing.
I wouldn't draw any conclusions about audio quality based on the echo test. Again, just sign up for service with an ITSP and try it out. Your only risk is the pittance you'll pay for service -- either you'll be thrilled, or not, at which point you can cancel it.
There is more to VoIP call quality than latency. If you want to test your internet connection's suitability for VoIP, use the G.711 CODEC test on this website:
http://myspeed.visualware.com/index.php
A MOS of 4.0 or above is fine; anything below that indicates a problem with your ISP's service.
Quote from: tns1 on March 05, 2015, 10:11:30 PM
The Obi echo test# does not sound particularly clear. There is a background hiss I wouldn't want to hear all the time. If this is indicative of call quality, do users find that adding a filtered phone cord helps?
Noise is not entering in the middle of the transmission... it's just packets of data traveling across the Internet. If you only hear the noise when calling a particular destination, then you could assume the noise is entering from that end... not your problem. If you don't hear the noise calling from one OBi PHONE jack to the other, then I would not worry about noise. If you do hear noise, then consider your own phone equipment and wiring. I doubt the analog side of the OBi is noisy.
And welcome to your new hobby! :)
I signed up for an Anveo 'free!' acct and obtained a local number for testing (total outlay $4.80). I used the ObiTalk portal rather than the direct manual method. I am not sure this saved me any confusion, since most of the how-tos seem to be written for manual method. I kept my Obitalk acct open on one window, while I walked thru the Anveo signup on another. There seems to be slight differences in terminology that had me questioning what data went where, but I did get it working. It took 6hrs for the Paypal payment to reach Anveo before I could make calls.
My reading suggests that the Obitalk portal (if you use it), will refresh the Obi settings every so often. Is this because these settings are subject to corruption, or that Obihai continues to tweak what it considers a good setup, or what? Why would I want to stick with Obitalk vs a manual (static) setup which seems more secure?
After setup, I made a few local, long distance, and toll free calls to test outgoing, and made a few calls from another house phone to test incoming. I find that the call quality is good. I do still have a slight background hiss present on all calls, but it is less offensive now that I began using a modern cordless handset, rather than the old corded one I had laying around.
One thing I didn't expect is that the call quality during Anveo voicemail retrieval(local) is really bad. I am referring just to the robo voice that guides you thru your messages, and not the actual recorded message content (which sound fine). The robo lady's voice quality is harsh, noisy and she seems to drop syllables and not speak in complete sentences. I think this dialog may be done with text to voice, as opposed to an actual recording. When someone calls in, the canned voicemail greeting is of good quality. I don't plan on using VM, but I may want to use a telemarketer screener (require a code entry to reach answering machine), so I may be using that call flow tool.
If you go back and read your original post, your goal was to replace your Plain Old Telephone Service (POTS) with the closest VoIP equivalent. We described how to do that, with the least amount of effort or opportunity for error.
Obihai's product line is designed to appeal to, and to be successfully set up by, several types of users, with a choice of interfaces. There is no one best method.
The OBiTALK web portal is geared toward simplicity of basic setup, while also offering access to "expert mode" advanced settings. It also supports a provisioning API for SIP VoIP service providers, to emulate the sort of "hands off" setup and management performed by large cable companies, or pure-play VoIP providers like Vonage. Obihai isn't "tweaking" or changing configuration settings remotely. The only thing they do is push firmware updates, if you so desire. This makes sense for the users in this scenario.
SIP ITSPs have always faced a problem: They can offer metered (per-minute, or buckets of minutes) outbound calling, with open SIP credentials that can be used on as many different SIP user agents (hardware ATA or softphone) as the user desires. Or, they can offer "unlimited" (subject to anti-abuse restrictions) calling, on a device with locked-down SIP credentials, to try to protect their service from fraudulent usage (one paid plan, being used by multiple users). The managed ITSP offerings via OBi were designed to help ITSPs with offering various service plans, optionally including a locked-down option for unlimited use.
The perceived security risk of using the portal is insignificant, as long as you use strong passwords for your OBiTALK portal account, and for your device admin, and for your SIP registrations.
The OBi device's local web server interface is geared toward technically-competent individual users, "enthusiast" or "hobbyist" users, and to business or carrier service providers, who want or need to create and maintain custom digit maps, dial plans, and other advanced options.
Again: you wanted "set it and forget it" service. I think we've given you that solution. It's your choice.
Thanks for the info. Many new concepts for me. If I understand you, the reason to use the Obitalk portal to provision my 202 is that it simplifies setup, prevents accidental changes, and prevents abuse by 3rd parties potentially costing me and/or my provider. That all sounds good to me. My goal of replacing a basic POTS line has not changed, and with my limited testing it looks like the Obi202 could do that very well. This doesn't mean I don't want to understand the security risks, or that I might not want more out of it in the future.
In the SIP scanner thread it is mentioned that Obihai uses one or more of the scan prevention methods (Oleg) for providers it recommends. I looked at the relevant settings with Obi Expert, and based on the thread I am not seeing that. My unused SPn services are still enabled, and my X_InboundCallRoute is still {ph1}. The only thing I see is that my X_UserAgentPort does not begin with 506.
I don't really know how the SIP scan exploit works, but it sounds like a good thing to prevent. Are these SIP scan remedies still a good idea to implement? If so, why were they not part of the basic provisioning? Is this only done for the Obitalk/Anveo annual plan? Did I do something incorrectly during setup?
thanks
The settings described in that thread are not defaults, and the majority of users don't experience this exploit. If you're concerned about it, you can add the modifications yourself; properly typed in, it won't hurt anything.
No doubt, someone will disagree with me, but in my own opinion, the only real-world risk of a SIP scanner is that somebody clever enough to exploit a SIP scan would at worst make some phone calls using your account, which you would eventually discover yourself. They're not going to be stealing your bank account information. They're looking for larger enterprise PBX installations where it might be worth the effort to use the system for large-scale robocalling. These days, SIP trunks are so cheap that trying to exploit someone else's account is rather pointless. The main reason to deal with it is if/when you start receiving annoying calls from fake scanner numbers.